B550 and B550I Systems slower with 1.2.0.7 Bios and 5800X3D CPU

Alan J T

Alan J T

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robman501154002d7 said:
Are you referring to E7C91AMS.1A0 from 7C91v1A.ZIP?
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Yep release date on it is 6th of June I would expect teh new bios to have a later date like 20th of June

Ane the change to the BIOS may also be why other boards have not received a final 1.2.0.7 BIOS but are still only a BETA one

But they could just replace the current bios with the molded one and change nothing else with Luck they may let the Mods know when they do it.
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Astennu

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robman501154002d7 said:
What's ADL?
I only took Windows 11 because it's new and I would like to learn it. :)
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Alder Lake. With its big little design. Win11 was optimized for that.


robman501154002d7 said:
Speaking of Windows 11.... would this be that fTPM stutter bug? Sometimes when I click on the start menu and click on the "Type here to search" box to enter an item, example "command prompt" or "cmd", and once I start typing the letters sometimes don't come up until a few seconds after. Haven't seen this behavior with Windows 10, could it be the BIOS or something to do with Windows 11?
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i dont know. But i thought tTPM stuttering was more a games thing and was a issue on both win 10 and 11. But im not sure never used it and not planning on using it either.
 
Alan J T

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Astennu

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Alan J T said:
Following BIOS have been released for R7 5800X3D CPU Under volt
7C92 MPG B550I GAMING EDGE WIFI
7C92 MPG B550I GAMING EDGE MAX WIFI
7C91 MPG B550 GAMING EDGE WIFI
7D13 MEG B550 UNIFY-X
7D13 MEG B550 UNIFY
Avail form the MSI Moderator Bios site
Code named KOMBO STRIKE Bios :unsure::unsure:
I have queried this

More BIOS for other boards will be released as they become Available
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Very interesting. The bios date of the 7C91.1B1 is from 4 day's ago.
I will be trying this one ^^
 
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cruisd614de02cb

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Absolutely incredible initial results. With a voltage offset of -0.25 (1.05V total in HWMonitor) through 10 minutes of Cinebench R23 I get a max temp of 60.5C compared to the 85C+ I was getting before. Going to run some additional tests to verify stability but this is amazing so far! MSI has quickly just gone back to the top of my list of favorite vendors because of this.

EDIT: R23 numbers are below what they should be but that's just a matter of tweaking settings and finding a happy medium.
 
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cruisd614de02cb

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So with some additional testing it seems there is a direct correllation between undervolting and R23 performance. Most likely due to maximum achievable boost clocks. No surprise there. Obviously every chip will vary. At stock my 5800X3D hits 14,600 depending on ambient room temps (cold day) and the chip doesn't hit 90C and thermal throttle. If it throttles I've seen it in the mid to low 13,000's. As of right now I've managed to get 14,400 consistently with an undervolt of -0.1375 and a max temp of 74C. This is a really good improvement overall and piece of mind. Gaming is pretty much unaffected. I'm going to continue playing with the settings to see if I can eek anymore performance without sacrificing thermals. Will post back at some point this weekend... Overall I'm quite thrilled :)
 
Astennu

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Good to hear you have good results already!
I just finished running tests on my current 1.2.0.6C bios. I will be testing 3D Mark CPU Profiler since that one also dectects stability issues way faster. Where Cinebensh could run 103.7BCLK and a -30CO 3Dmark would crash at -19CO.
 
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Initial Results are not that great here:

1656155220524.png

Its again much slower on stock BCLK.
And this time 103.687 BCLK was not even stable anymore. With the E7C91AMS.190 1.2.0.6C bios i could run up to 103.9x BCLK and still run 3DMark stable.
With this 1B1 bios only 4,2 and 1 thread would be stable 16 and 8 are crashing straight away.
The Score of the 1T was also way lower 908 vs 928-933 with the 1.2.0.6C bios.

So even if the UV will help me get performance up a bit i doubt it will be faster than the 1.2.0.6C bios. But i will do some more testing.

Edit:
1656156778670.png

This is with Kombo Strike mode 2. Performance is now slightly up compared to stock 1.2.0.6C. But Mode 3 was not even stable it crashed. So i dont think i will have any BCLK OC headroom left when running mode 2. I will now first test some UV to see what that does for the performance.

Edit2:
-voltage offset lowers boost clocks. CB R20 and 3DMark scores are lower if you apply a lower voltage. I noticed the same thing happening with the old bios when i was messing with LLC to get a lower load voltage. You need to use Kombo Strike to get the performance back up. But my CPU is already 3DMark unstable with -0.0250v and KS Mode 2. So i wont be able to beat the performance of the 1.2.0.6C bios its way better performance and stability wise.
 
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Astennu

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Alan J T said:
Please see Sticky in AMD Section for more Info on R7 5800X3D Beta Bios

Click to expand...
I did some additional testing this weekend and this morning.
The problem seems to be unstable DRam Settings. Settings that run perfectly fine with the 1.2.0.6C bios are completely unstable on the new Beta.
When droppring ram speeds from 3800 to 3266for testing im now able to get a bit better scores with the new bios. Still working on the Single Thread part but MT with -0.0625mv and Kombo Strike Mode 2 has a slight uplift.

When im done tweaking that i will take a look at the max DRAM clocks with this bios and then the gaming performance. If thats lower because of the slower ram its also a no go.

I wonder what change is impacting the Dram overclocking so much.
 
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robman501154002d7

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Looks good! The site for the B550 Gaming Edge Wifi is still showing up as the beta 7C91v1A from 2022-06-06 . It looks like this new upcoming release is geared to the 5800x series of CPU's?
For a Ryzen 5600x owner, would it be worth while taking once the final build comes out? I'll keep monitoring the forum to see if it offers any improvements. I feel like now I need to get one of the X3D CPU's. LOL
I don't play around with the timings, voltages or any overclocking/volting, underclocking/volting so I wouldn't know.
 
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jdgesmlls

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Yes, I would like some clarification on "B550 and B550I Systems slower with 1.2.0.7 Bios" and if the OP believes this is strictly related to the 5800X3D/unstable RAM timings/both?

The Kombo Strike BIOS allows for undervolting of the 5800X3D but are there any other improvements over 7C91v1A? Running B550 Gaming Edge Wifi on 1.2.0.6c BIOS / 5900x w/ CO and customer RAM timings from DRAM calculator. Everything is stable, so unsure if I would upgrade regardless but trying to understand if the 1.2.0.7 BIOS ( 7C91v1A) is across the board slower. Thanks!
 
Astennu

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robman501154002d7 said:
Looks good! The site for the B550 Gaming Edge Wifi is still showing up as the beta 7C91v1A from 2022-06-06 . It looks like this new upcoming release is geared to the 5800x series of CPU's?
For a Ryzen 5600x owner, would it be worth while taking once the final build comes out? I'll keep monitoring the forum to see if it offers any improvements. I feel like now I need to get one of the X3D CPU's. LOL
I don't play around with the timings, voltages or any overclocking/volting, underclocking/volting so I wouldn't know.
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If you dont play with these things it probably wont matter much. And if you dont use fTPM secure modules for Win11 you dont need a 1.2.0.7 bios.
I dont know how the Dram OC with 1.2.0.7 biosses is on non X3D CPU's you would have to test. But i see serious regression in stability.
 
Astennu

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jdgesmlls said:
Yes, I would like some clarification on "B550 and B550I Systems slower with 1.2.0.7 Bios" and if the OP believes this is strictly related to the 5800X3D/unstable RAM timings/both?

The Kombo Strike BIOS allows for undervolting of the 5800X3D but are there any other improvements over 7C91v1A? Running B550 Gaming Edge Wifi on 1.2.0.6c BIOS / 5900x w/ CO and customer RAM timings from DRAM calculator. Everything is stable, so unsure if I would upgrade regardless but trying to understand if the 1.2.0.7 BIOS ( 7C91v1A) is across the board slower. Thanks!
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The slower part is about the 3D Mark scores. When i made this thread there was no 1B1 bios with Kobo Strike and both Stock no BCLK OC the old official bios (.190 1.2.0.6C) Was a lot faster 2-4% and thats quite a lot for a bios update. Note this is only tested with X3D so possible the normal Zen3 CPU's dont have this issue.
With 1B1 beta you can use Kobo Strike Mode 2 to be equal again. But Dram stability seems to be 150MHz lower than the old bios with my BDie Sticks and the same voltages and Timings.

My 1.2.0.6C bios settings where 100% tweaked and 100% stable. So i instantly noticed issues with the new bios when using the same settings. Stability tests and benshmarks would crash and scores are lower.

I updated the Title to reflect the use of the X3D CPU.
 
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robman501154002d7

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Astennu said:
And if you dont use fTPM secure modules for Win11 you dont need a 1.2.0.7 bios.
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Well... I do have fTPM enabled (BIOS is on the default settings). I don't know how to use it though within Windows 11. I am seeing a stutter with the start menu at times.
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Alan J T

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Astennu said:
The slower part is about the 3D Mark scores. When i made this thread there was no 1B1 bios with Kobo Strike and both Stock no BCLK OC the old official bios (.190 1.2.0.6C) Was a lot faster 2-4% and thats quite a lot for a bios update. Note this is only tested with X3D so possible the normal Zen3 CPU's dont have this issue.
With 1B1 beta you can use Kobo Strike Mode 2 to be equal again. But Dram stability seems to be 150MHz lower than the old bios with my BDie Sticks and the same voltages and Timings.

My 1.2.0.6C bios settings where 100% tweaked and 100% stable. So i instantly noticed issues with the new bios when using the same settings. Stability tests and benshmarks would crash and scores are lower.

I updated the Title to reflect the use of the X3D CPU.
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Out of interest and Information from another users can you Disable Memory fast boot in the bios and see if this stabilises you RAM.
I all ways set mine to Gear Down as I found it was less problematic with four dims since bios 1.2.0.5
The Disable memory Fast boot seems to also help some Users.
 
Astennu

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cruisd614de02cb said:
Which kombo strike have people found to be the best? I just immediately jumped to 3...
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3 has the best performance but its not stable with higher BCLK OC's in combination with near 3600MHzCL16 Ram with my CPU's (tested 3 CPU's).
So im running mode 2 with BCLK102.9 and Dram 3567MHz.


Alan J T said:
Out of interest and Information from another users can you Disable Memory fast boot in the bios and see if this stabilises you RAM.
I all ways set mine to Gear Down as I found it was less problematic with four dims since bios 1.2.0.5
The Disable memory Fast boot seems to also help some Users.
Click to expand...
Thanks i will give it a try.
I did notice the Latency's are quite good in the DramCalc memtest even tho the clocks are lower. But transfer took a bigger hit.
Im using 2x16GB Corsair dual rank Samsung B-Die sticks.


bdmoybusines15aa02e2 said:
I jumped to 3, clocks boost in Cinebench for me but not for gaming like Warzone. Clocks stayed the same as stock.
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Maybe you are not looking at the effective clocks then. Because i see a clear difference in boost clocks when running off vs mode 2-3. They are like 150MHz higher in CB R20 over here score also reflects that im hitting 58xx in Multi threaded testing. Im using a 0.0625mv undervolt.
 
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