B660M-A PRO DDR4 stuck rebooting after windows update

[KieranJJo154702d3]

while installing a windows update, partway through the pc starts to loop as follows:

power on
all fans start spinning, decorative leds turn on, etc
verify whether cpu or dram light turns on first
white vga indicator on motherboard lights up and stays lit
red cpu light turns on for a split second before pc shuts off
repeat

sometimes after changing the RAM sticks, the screen will show text "new ram detected, press F1 to configure settings, F2 to continue"
prior to this update my PC was fully functional and normal.

Specs:
Motherboard: MSI PRO B660M-A WIFI DDR4 (bios update service purchased from PB with the motherboard & CPU in early 2023)
CPU: Intel i5 13500
RAM: Corsair Vengeance Black RGB Pro SL DDR4 3600MHz 2x16GB CMH32GX4M2D3600C18
GPU: EVGA RTX 3080 XC3 Ultra
Power Supply: Corsair HX1000 Platinum
Storage: Crucial P3 Plus 1TB NVME M.2 Internal SSD and 2 other secondary HDDs
Case: Deepcool Matrexx 70

solutions I have tried already (in no particular order):
none of these have deviated the pc from the above loop
unplug all peripherals and monitors
boot from a windows 10 installation USB
boot from a windows 11 installation USB
disconnect any secondary HDD storage devices (D and E drives)
disconnect the C drive (which had windows installed)
connect only one of the old secondary HDD and windows USB
connect a spare HDD and windows usb
disconnect all HDD/SSD
disconnect all HDD/SSD and use windows usb
disconnect and reconnect all PSU cords
swap out the cpu cooler
try various RAM configurations, including using only 1 stick
short the CMOS jumper
uninstall the GPU

 

[citay]

You have tried a lot, but i don't know if you tried with an absolutely minimal configuration: Everything disconnected or taken out, except the PSU, the CPU and the cooler. So the RAM goes out, GPU out, all drives out, all USB cables out (internal and external). The result should normally be the DRAM LED (because the CPU is there, but no RAM). Then you add one RAM module in slot A2. If it now proceeds to the BOOT LED, you check for a picture on the board's graphics ports, and you can plug in the keyboard again of course.

If you can see the BIOS, i would update it via M-Flash to the latest beta or latest stable from https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/PRO-B660M-A-WIFI-DDR4/support

Then add back devices/cables one by one and check if/where the problem reappears.

 

[KieranJJo154702d3]

Thank you for the response!

I have now tried a minimal configuration with no RAM or devices and additionally disconnected all of the headers at the bottom of the motherboard except for the power button. This has resulted in the PC starting and holding a constant orange DRAM light without restarting. When connecting a cable to my monitor the monitor briefly turns on but detects no signal and soon goes back to sleep.

I then attempted installing a single RAM stick in the A2 position which caused the "new ram detected, press F1 to configure settings, F2 to continue" screen to appear and the white VGA indicator to light up before the PC abruptly shut off and then restarted. I have attempted this with multiple different RAM sticks to the same effect. When the "new ram detected" screen appears the PC takes significantly longer to shut off (about 15 seconds of VGA indicator), but any subsequent restarts shut off much quicker.

 

[citay]

Hmm. You see, this is an odd problem, because a simple Windows update should not be able to influence what the board is doing during early POST, this is way before Windows even starts to boot. So the only thing i can think of is that you somehow got served a BIOS update via Windows Update, because it saw that your BIOS version was too outdated or something. And since there was this huge problem with buggy microcode from Intel, which caused voltage spikes that could damage CPUs over time, maybe they thought that they should forcibly apply a later BIOS to people who haven't heard about that problem yet. Although it only affects real 13th and 14th gen ones like the -K models, your i5-13500 is still 12th-gen-based (i have the same model) and didn't even use the buggy microcode.

This was a bit odd about your original post as well:

Motherboard: MSI PRO B660M-A WIFI DDR4 (bios update service purchased from PB with the motherboard & CPU in early 2023)

Does this mean, a one-time update to the latest BIOS version at the time of purchase, or something? I mean, whenever you buy a new system, you expect the latest BIOS version (at the time of building it) to be on there, otherwise they haven't done their full job. But later, it's part of normal maintenance of the system to do a BIOS update every once in a while, especially when becoming aware of major issues in previous versions. Granted, while the BIOS update itself is not that difficult, re-entering any custom settings they might have made, this could be challenging for some users.

But yeah, BIOS updates are part and parcel of owning a PC nowadays, partly because the earliest BIOS versions are often chock-full of bugs (sometimes called "bananaware", they sell boards of a new platform with a very incomplete state of BIOS development, and it ripens at the user later), partly because they sometimes discover grave bugs / security holes later and have to rush out updates to fix them.

Was that "PB" shop helping you with any BIOS updates down the road? Or just the initial one, which i would've assumed would be included anyway in building the PC?

If this is a BIOS update gone wrong somehow, the main problem is, on these lower-end B-series board models, they don't implement a Flash BIOS Button for easy flashing in case of problems. So in order to flash the BIOS again, we have to somehow get it into a state where you can at least enter the BIOS and start the flashing from there. No boot loops or anything.

I'd say, if it's this problematic in minimal configuration, perhaps try to rule out the PSU next. The only way to rule it out is to test with a different PSU. The test PSU has to be known good, not too old (preferably still within the warranty period), and of decent quality. You can connect it on-the-fly using its own cables, shouldn't be much of a hassle.

Furthermore, you can try with the board on a non-conductive surface like a wooden table. You could also take off the CPU cooler, take out the CPU, and check for bent pins in the socket, also see here and the following posts. While they are technically all bent, the pins all have to look completely uniform under light, the tips of the pins have to line up in a perfect pattern, with none visually sticking out from the rest. I know, clutching at straws here, but why not try to rule out everything possible. I've seen bent pins cause delayed problems before (although it would be odd to run fine for over two years).

 

[KieranJJo154702d3]

In the end, I took it to a repair shop, which found that the SSD was faulty with low read/write speeds, and the motherboard was also faulty.
Thankfully, they were both still under warranty.

 

[citay]

which found that the SSD was faulty with low read/write speeds

Well, the P3 Plus is just a bad performer, it uses a single-core DRAM-less controller with slow QLC NAND flash. It can perform horribly bad on sustained writes, it only sells well because of its low price. So i'm sceptical about their diagnosis regarding the SSD. The board, ok, that makes more sense, if they properly tested it barebones etc.

 

[rene155b02d8]

I also have the same problem.
Board is PRO B660M-A WiFi DDR4 with a i5-12500.
It worked for 4 years (so it is outside warranty).
I only use Linux and did not update the BIOS recently.
It just stopped working, and nothing helps (no SSD, different PSU, changed and minimal RAM and additional Graphics Card), I tried everything and still the same bootloop, with no opportunity to enter the BIOS.

What can I do?

 

[citay]

Can you list all your components in detail (exact models of everything including PSU), as well as what you have tried so far, including the model of the different PSU? This is the best way to help. We need to know your hardware, we need to know how it happened (all of a sudden one day, or gradually, what are the symptoms, what are the EZ Debug LEDs showing), we need to know exactly what you tried.

If you really saw the exact symptoms like in this thread, you can write it here, otherwise it's better to open a new thread,

 

[rene155b02d8]

PRO B660M-A WIFI DDR4, i5-12500, BeQuiet System Power 9 (400W), 2x Kingston KVR32N22S8/16, Samsung SSD980.
It happened all of a sudden, EZDEBUG LED goes from red-yellow-white red flash to reboot.
Tried another PSU (quality PSU but was borrowed, don't remember model), same with additional GPU. But bootloop persists. Also BIOS reset with Jumper (battery is not accessible). Changed RAM (1 module, 2 modules, switched) and without RAM stop at yellow and no reboot.
Checked wiring etc, no discs, no external components.
ATM I'm using a Phone Here, so typing is difficult.
BIOS is older, no recent update.
Thanks

 

[citay]

Hmm. System Power 9 is one of their low-end offerings, and could be around eight years by now, so it could start to get flaky, but let's assume that the other test PSU was suitable and the PSU is ruled out. The RAM is some bog-standard JEDEC kit without XMP, so no reason for that to become bad prematurely. But you can try to borrow other RAM just to be sure (since the OP mentioned something RAM-related). The SSD, well, you just leave out, yeah. You can also unplug all internal and external USB cables, apart from the keyboard.

When the board reboots after flashing the CPU LED briefly at the end, does it briefly shut off in between (just asking because the OP mentioned that)?

Anyway, the issue is, once you ruled everything out that you could without too much effort (PSU, RAM, USB stuff), then we're back to my reply from a bit further above, that on a B-series board you don't have too many options, it's a shame MSI haven't fitted it with a Flash BIOS Button. There are ways to flash the BIOS using an external flash programmer, and that programmer isn't even expensive, but you'd have to read some guides on how to do it. I could give you some pointers if it comes to that. For now, maybe borrow different RAM, maybe find out the other PSU's model (so that it's not some bad/old one).

 

[rene155b02d8]

Everything else is already disconnected.
I will try to borrow a different RAM module, but I doubt both of my modules are damaged.
I'm also sorry, there is no better way to flash the BIOS, but I fear usage of a flash programmer needs a PC and only a phone will not suffice
Nevertheless thanks for trying and I will communicate with Support tomorrow.

 

[citay]

Yeah, there is almost no way the RAM became defective like that, it's just in case the board can somehow cope with other RAM better now. It seems that this board model, if it has 100% exactly like same symptoms as the OP had, might be prone to whatever has happened, in certain circumstances. And if that's the case, then you can't try that much else.

What I can still recommend is a CPU re-seat (taking it out and then back in, and using that opportunity to also inspect the socket for any bent pins, see here and the following posts). This can help with contact issues between the CPU and the socket. As to why they would appear after all this time, no idea, but why not try it.

After that, the only thing you can do at home would be to flash the BIOS chip, or have it flashed (sometimes PC repair shops can do this). Yes, you need another system for it, but maybe ask a friend, maybe someone has a laptop, or you can take the board there for flashing. If you want to do this, the cost is not very high, and I can give you some info about it.