PC sometimes won't wake up from sleep mode, red + yellow lights on MB

[hupimies2151a02d0]

Board: X670E Tomahawk WIFI
BIOS: 7E12v1E
GPU: AsRock RX 7900 XT Phantom Gaming OC
CPU: Ryzen 7 7800X3D
Cooler: Noctua NH-D15
RAM: 2x16GB Corsair Vengeance 6000MHz
SSD: Samsung 2TB 990 PRO
PSU: Corsair 850W RM850x
SYS: Windows 11 Home x64 Ver. 10.0.22631

About 7/10 times the pc wakes up normally from sleep mode, during which red and yellow light on motherboard (CPU, RAM) flash. 3/10 times the lights light up for about 30 seconds, after which they turn off about the same time. After this only black screen, USB devices get power (leds on mouse light up, not on keyboard) but no other connection. Have waited for over 30 minutes, no change. Always gets fixed by forced shutoff via holding down the power button, after this boots up to saved state (previous applications open etc.) No problems on regular startup.

Worked normally for about a year, problem started a few months ago suddenly. Didn't disconnect or open up the PC / download any software / do anything else notable which could have caused system change. All temps during benchmarks normal and no problems during running. PC has never crashed etc.

List of things that have not fixed the problem:

Updated BIOS
Reset BIOS settings through BIOS menu, haven't cleared CMOS with jumping
Updated GPU drivers
Updated Windows from 10 to 11
Reset Windows power settings through troubleshooting
Turned off fast startup
Unplugged and reconnected PSU (also removed and reconnected GPU, didn't try to boot without it)
RAM are in slots A2 and B2 per the manual, as they have always been

Not a huge problem, but very annoying since I primarily keep PC in sleep mode. Also have to think that constant forced shutoff doesn't do the PC any favors. Any thoughts on possible fixes? Could clearing CMOS have any other effect than resetting through the BIOS menu does?

 

[mick.715b402e6]

It's not only MSI but Gigabyte also, and who knows what other vendor. My issue seems to have been fixed. I have MCR and Power down both on ENABLED and have set the timings and voltages manually, it has been over a week now with waking up from sleep normal. The only additional factor is I sold my 4080 super half way through and now I am with integrated CPU graphics so I don't know if that could be doing something too...try and let us know!

Disabled XMP profile. For now it seems to wake up fine again.

 

[mack0y7]

New BIOS, same problem. Even with default settings, it works randomly.

 

[MadSky]

New BIOS, same problem. Even with default settings, it works randomly.

To prevent a misunderstanding:
Are you saying that when using BIOS 7E12v1G at 100% default settings (no OC/EXPO/PBO etc.) the PC does not wake from sleep sometimes?

 

[mack0y7]

To prevent a misunderstanding:
Are you saying that when using BIOS 7E12v1G at 100% default settings (no OC/EXPO/PBO etc.) the PC does not wake from sleep sometimes?

I am using a B650M Mortar so currently AJ BIOS in my case. Yes at default settings including 4800MT/s RAM speed, it fails to wake up from sleep.

 

[lyubostefano157102da]

1. This is a known issue with a lot of the MSI boards. It's probably a BIOS bug.
2. Same wake from sleep problem here:
   - MSI MAG B650 TOMAHAWK WIFI
3. - Ryzen 5 7600
4. - G.Skill Z5 Neo F5-6000J3038F16G (CL30) - supported in the OVL list of the mainboard
5. Enabling EXPO makes the PC not wake from sleep. Especially when using the MSI overclocking menu.
6. Setting the RAM speed to 5200 MT/s and enabling EXPO using the AMD overclocking menu, and not the MSI and the wake from sleep issue occurs occasionally.
7. Disabling EXPO and running 4800 MT/s and higher latency and the issue is gone. I assume it has something to do with the RAM voltage when waking from sleep. Lowering the RAM voltage from 1.35V to 1.25V seems to mitigate the issue and it occurs occasionally.
8. The reddit forums are full with complaints concerning wake from sleep. MSI please fix this, or at least announce it to be a known issue.

 

[santosh.dayapul15bd02ea]

I'm facing the same issue. This is a Major bug. MSI should be fixing it at priority.
Would Microcenter replace with other brand x670e if we have their warranty?

 

[trio.f129e02a8]

Bump for MSI to finally wake up!

 

[HoovaDevil]

I have X670E Carbon Wifi with the same issue.
When I built it in May 2024 it would resume from sleep with EXPO enabled.
I decided to upgrade to AM5/X670 quite late because I though all of the bugs and issues would be solved.
However, it eventually started to BSoD at some point. This might be hours or just 20mins.
It took a while before I realised it only occurred after waking from S3.
I updated to BIOS 1J1 and although it would no longer BSoD it would sometimes fail to resume.
It can sometimes resume 1 or 2 times but then fails again.
When it fails the last debug code is 11 (00 can show for 10-20 secs) and the CPU LED (red) is lit. It does not progress and the reset button has to be used.
I have contacted MSI and performed testing, including complete (clean) installation of Windows 11 and updated all drivers but the issue persists.
I have also tested with Ubuntu 24.04.1 both Live USB and a clean install. The issue persists.
MSI suggest that it is a problem with the OS, drivers or a CPU/socker fault (bent pins or fracture) but the system has been stable using BIOS 1J1 since July 2024.
I have also tested legacy BIOS versions and the only one that allows S3 sleep to resume correctly every time is v120.
The fact that the debug code stops at an early stage and does not progress indicates that the other phases required for S3 resume are not being executed.
Of course, if the CPU LED is to be believed it has either failed or is missing and so S3 resume cannot continue.
Has anyone in this thread had success with any 600 series chipset board?
How many of you have opened a ticket? What was the support response?
It appears that MSI does not accept that this is an issue that requires their attention.
I would like to hear what others think and perhaps we can persuade MSI that it does warrant investigation.

 

[MadSky]

Users get a temporary ban for saying what they really think about the general quality and MSI's handling of old and new BIOS releases.
Other users report that MSI's support will put you through hoops even if you are contacting support about a known issue.
So I'm just going to say that I'm not a happy bunny in those regards for now over a year.

 

[Michele P]

First things first.
it's not a MSI specific problem but a more widespread AM5 problem, they even relesead a specific chipset driver to issue this bug last year
To be honest I have no idea if MSI is more prone to this specific bug or not, I'm not excluding this.
Personally I don't use this feature a lot but when I do I never had a single problem resuming from sleep

if you do your own research you will find a lots of different reports, but coming also from other board manufacturers.
just few links as example

gigabyte

Computer reboots just about every time when it wakes up from sleep. I Lose everything i was doing in process. - Microsoft Q&A

Hi, thanks in advance for looking. My computer reboots when it wakes up from sleep, as the title mentioned. This is quite inconvenient, as whatever I had opened closes. Specifically, when it is sleeping I press a button on the keyboard or move the…

answers.microsoft.com

https://www.reddit.com/r/gigabyte/comments/1i6s360

https://www.reddit.com/r/gigabyte/comments/1hbilp9

asus

https://www.reddit.com/r/ASUS/comments/1exoilh

Sleep/wake issue, Crosshair X670E Hero

I'm pulling my hair out over an issue that has recently appeared out of nowhere. When my PC goes to sleep for more than a couple of minutes, it will not wake up again. On moving the mouse etc the fans spin very briefly but then it shuts down. Sometimes it will restart normally when I press the...

rog-forum.asus.com

Custom PC Builders | Randomly after my PC goes to sleep the DRAM light will come on out of no where | Facebook

Randomly after my PC goes to sleep the DRAM light will come on out of no where. And then I have to shut the PC down and restart it. And then it boots into safe mode and I have to tell it to boot to...

www.facebook.com

asrock

X670e Taichi Carrara Bios 3.10 problems

you can enter the bios at 4800mhz, set the expo/xmp profiles, but it fails at memory training? what...

forum.asrock.com

https://www.reddit.com/r/ASRock/comments/17jble1

https://www.reddit.com/r/ASRock/comments/1hogxth

You can try few things to mitigate or solve the problem if you are lucky
- Memory context restore and Power down disabled
- Expo disabled, all timings and voltages manually set
- keep the AMD chipset driver updated (and every other device drivers, lan, gpu...)
- don't use the feature at all if you can. I know it's sad but even without putting the system on sleep the power drain it's not so big....

 

[mh3marefa157602e1]

Has anyone in this thread had success with any 600 series chipset board?
How many of you have opened a ticket? What was the support response?
It appears that MSI does not accept that this is an issue that requires their attention.
I would like to hear what others think and perhaps we can persuade MSI that it does warrant investigation.

Hello,
I had this problem for 6 months until in page 1, OP suggested disabling XMP/EXPO. I did that and indeed it has fixed it for me for I think past 4 months.
But some people reported that disabling it does not fix sleep for them. One reported that manually setting RAM voltages and timings as @Michele P suggested worked for them.
Another user on B650 has reported another approach that has fixed all of his boot problems (including Sleep). I personally would like to try this myself since sometimes I fail to cold boot the PC and boot times leaves much to be desired (even with XMP disabled).

As for tickets, MSI response to failed Sleep has been:
Ticket#1:
It seems X3D CPUs cannot resume from sleep if XMP/EXPO enabled.

Content:
Regarding your concern, please clear CMOS (How to clear CMOS. Please refer to the manual) for a try, then only enable the XMP in bios to check. If the issue still persists, please manual enable the memory context restore (BIOS>Overclocking) option in bios for a try.

Ticket#2:
It seems X3D CPUs cannot resume from sleep if XMP/EXPO enabled.
[above didn't work]
Content:
Thank you for your information, you can manual adjust a bit of ram voltage or CPU voltage for a try. If it does not work, the latest bios version of the motherboard is v1L1, please also update the bios to latest version from MSI Website. Please update the bios by M-Flash in bios.

 

[flashig158102e5]

Have the same problem with MSI MAG Z790 Tomahawk WIFI + Corsair Vengeance DDR5 6400MHz 32GB CL32. If I turn on XMP profile, my PC doesn't wake up in 1/3 cases.

 

[HoovaDevil]

Hi. @MadSky I agree with not allowing anyone to post derogatory or inflammatory comments based on their personal outrage and I don't see that I have done so.
@Michele P I have been researching this issue since July 2024. I have viewed at least several hundred articles and they have nothing that works. I am aware that this affects all board vendors and have stated such to MSI. I am aware that for some the issue can be "fixed" by disabling EXPO. I will check the links you have provided.

I should explain that when I built my system in May 2024 S3 resume was working!

However, the system was having a BSoD every now and again. I put this down to the fact that the 2x32GB sticks were not on the QVL and spent days changing RAM settings.
I also ran memory diagnostics for 24 hours to rule out a physical RAM issue and it passed every test.

It then dawned on me that the BSoD (which could happen after several hours of use) only occurred if the system was woken from S3 sleep. I tested it for extended periods (24 hours) from a cold boot/restart and the system remained stable but once it was placed it into sleep and woken a BSoD would occur at some point. This is when I contacted MSI. Before I got their reply I had already updated to BIOS 1J1 (2024/07/10) and it initially seemed to work.

After a few days the system would fail to wake. It was on, keyboard lit but unresponsive, no display output and the debug display was showing a floating temp (42-45). This then changed to showing a debug code of 11 or sometimes it only read 00. Debug code 11 is a very early stage of the boot process (Pre-memory CPU initialization is started) that occurs long before the system has even begun to load the OS.

WARNING: Please note that v120 was used for test purposes only, it should not be used otherwise. It raises SOC to 1.35V when EXPO is enabled and does not contain security patches.

As stated I have tested a previous BIOS v120. The S3 resume works every time without EXPO enabled. With EXPO enabled this BIOS disables S3. It is no longer an available option (powercfg -a). It is curious that later BIOS versions do not disable S3 when EXPO is enabled.

I am using BIOS v1J1 right now. I have performed tests using every BIOS from v120 to the present 1M0 and all but v120 break S3.
I will also point-out that with v1J1 the system can sometimes resume from S3. It may even complete 2 sleep cycles in succession but fail on the 3rd.

So, given that I have had no issues with system stability at all since June 2024 (with BIOS 1J1) suggests that there is no hardware issue present.

I have even tested these BIOS with a clean install Ubuntu 24.04.1 (both Live USB and full install) and the issue is still present, except for BIOS v120.
In my mind that should prove that the issue is with the BIOS.

MSI have just responded. They say "it is hard to determine what caused the issue" and now ask if I can perform cross testing of other CPU, RAM and that I should also try different CPU/RAM.

It seems obvious that they want me to prove (at my expense) that the issue does belong to them.
If there is anyone here who has not opened a support ticket, please, do so.

 

[Michele P]

I forgot to say that everybody should also disable the windows fast start option (no reason to keep that activated unless you have the OS installed on a mechanical drive, and we live in 2025)
Otherwise this sleep bug will affect the system even more often.
And linux user should stay onlts kernel versions, preferably 6.6 instead of 6.11/12

The problem for me resides in Agesa, in particular the way it manages:
- memory context restore
- power down
- expo
- cpu power states and eventual cpu protections added for safety measures.

Many of those things were not properly functional in the early stages of agesa, this is also why the oldest bioses do not exhibit the problem.
The specific sleep patch added in amd chipset drivers was maybe targeted to older agesa versions… while the new ones are broken again.

Release after release, we can now have reliable fast memory trainings and a cpu that operates in a safer way (limited soc voltages for example, but also other less publicly known hardware safety instructions and security mitigations)

All good things, but not without side effects apparently, like this sleep bug we are talking about (and maybe the difficulties to restart when expo is enabled)

agesa must work in armony with the amd chipset drivers, given there’s nothing else interfering. Yes, other devices, relative drivers, and even microsoft updates, can easily break such a fragile feature.

Said that it’s obvious the bug will affect almost every manufacturer, maybe some more than others. But it’s also clear that diagnosing a problem with so many variables it’s not easy. Those MSI support answers are understandable. On my x670 ace I don’t use sleep regularly, but I can’t replicate the issue either.

Idk if opening tickets is a good idea.
Maybe mass report the bug on AMD subreddit?
Replying “me too” to every other report you find in different places?
Let the issue have more public visibility, outside the specific vendor channels

 

[MadSky]

Have the same problem with MSI MAG Z790 Tomahawk WIFI + Corsair Vengeance DDR5 6400MHz 32GB CL32. If I turn on XMP profile, my PC doesn't wake up in 1/3 cases.

But that's an Intel board. So this issue is not related to AMD only, but Intel as well?
It's as if all new technology is terrible in one way or another...

 

[mack0y7]

Many of those things were not properly functional in the early stages of agesa, this is also why the oldest bioses do not exhibit the problem.

So that's probably why BIOS with AGESA 1.0.0.7 rarely if at all had the wake from sleep issue.

Anyway, I gave up on this. Pretty sure this won't be fixed.

Search - AMD Community

community.amd.com

 

[Michele P]

It's as if all new technology is terrible in one way or another...

I think the opposite, it's the feature that's quite outdated
I use ups all around my house and I know my old computers drain 120/150watts (@idle) on average, while this new pc idles around 60watts
Using sleep was much more reasonable on old tech, while on new tech I find it a bit overkill if I have to leave the pc unattended for a while.
New cpus and gpus, while pushing limits a bit too much, at least have evolved in terms of power efficiency (compared to old tech)

But a broken feature it's still a broken feature, whether it's reasonable or not on a desktop pc is my personal opinion.
I built my first pc with an intel 486, so I'm pretty old, with time I've learned that putting a desktop pc to sleep is never a reliable option... I got burned too many times and lost important data, so I've learned to live without it.
If you need to use sleep extensively, I suggest opting for a different type of hardware to begin with.

I don't know if it will ever be fixed, maybe a new agesa or chipset driver will fix things.... but don't expect to be permanent, sooner or later the feature will break again
Because it very easy to break, on intel systems too as you can see, and the adoption of the new DDR5 is not helping

 

[Psylocke]

I think the opposite, it's the feature that's quite outdated
I use ups all around my house and I know my old computers drain 120/150watts (@idle) on average, while this new pc idles around 60watts
Using sleep was much more reasonable on old tech, while on new tech I find it a bit overkill if I have to leave the pc unattended for a while.
New cpus and gpus, while pushing limits a bit too much, at least have evolved in terms of power efficiency (compared to old tech)

But a broken feature it's still a broken feature, whether it's reasonable or not on a desktop pc is my personal opinion.
I built my first pc with an intel 486, so I'm pretty old, with time I've learned that putting a desktop pc to sleep is never a reliable option... I got burned too many times and lost important data, so I've learned to live without it.
If you need to use sleep extensively, I suggest opting for a different type of hardware to begin with.

I don't know if it will ever be fixed, maybe a new agesa or chipset driver will fix things.... but don't expect to be permanent, sooner or later the feature will break again
Because it very easy to break, on intel systems too as you can see, and the adoption of the new DDR5 is not helping

Sounds somewhat like what I do once I have windows installed on any new build. I go through the power saving features and shut off any sleep or hibernation functions. I've never had a good experience with them and so I make sure that both are turned off. I do have the monitors turn off after about 30 minutes, but otherwise most power saving features get turned off.

We don't turn off the two pc's that we have at the house, both are desktops, (one built in 2011 and the other in 2013), both are on 24/7 (except if we go out of town for more than 7 days) and both are still running strong. I'm going to have to build two new one's before October, and so I've been researching what I want to build and seeing how all the manufactures are having some type of issues is not encouraging. My hope is that when I do decide on the build that most of the issues have been ironed out.

Psy

 

[HoovaDevil]

@Psylocke There are many reasons why S3 resume can fail but this will be reported (debug code). This failure occurs very early in the initialisation process at a point that does not even reach the S3 boot script phase. S3 Boot errors would be indicated with a debug code in the range E8-EF.
@Michele P I must disagree that S3 is an "outdated" feature. The fact that many have an issue with using it suggests otherwise. I have used sleep for over a decade without issue. Also, S3 sleep uses only a couple of watts (my system draws 2W) as it is not providing power to the CPU etc. It supplies only those circuits which are required to keep the RAM refreshed and enable the system to wake-up eg USB and LAN.

I would gladly use Hibernate on this system but when wakened all fans are forced to full speed and only return to a normal level after about 4 minutes. This indicates that the BIOS fan settings are ignored. I doubt that reporting this will result in a fix as it would be considered a preference rather than an issue.

I have, using a reasonable method, proven that the BIOS implementation of S3 resume is broken in all but one of the BIOS versions (v120 for a 7900X) barring a peculiar failure of hardware that allows allows it to work correctly.

I have already posted this issue in forums other than this one.

 

[HoovaDevil]

I have just received a reply from MSI. Their last message was unambiguous in that it stated that I should try other CPU/RAM.

The message states:
"We have found this problem in our tests, not sure which device caused it, as we replied before, it may require cross testing device."

However, they specifically mention that they have found it using "default setting". We will have to wait and see if their fix also solves the issue when using EXPO.