Windows 11 Question (TPM? -> External TPM Module = Not Mandatory)

Pangolin

Pangolin

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Note. Below information is based on current latest Microsoft release document (2021/06/25)
Windows Requirement
1624618048576.png

Secure Boot capable (Not necessarily to be enabled)
TPM version 2.0 (fTPM or dTPM) - Discrete TPM card is NOT mandatory when fTPM works

For information of MSI TPM 2.0 card (dTPM)
https://www.msi.com/Motherboard/TPM-20-Module

Test your compatibility with Windows 11
Windows Official Test Tool (Removed by Microsoft)
Alternative: WhyNotWin11
https://github.com/rcmaehl/WhyNotWin11/releases/latest/download/WhyNotWin11.exe

Step to enable relative BIOS options, you can check the video below. (fTPM)

Intel Platform
BIOS\Settings\Security\Trusted Computing\TPM Device Selection
1624618916116.png

AMD Platform
BIOS\Settings\Security\Trusted Computing\AMD fTPM switch
1624618957337.png

For newer PRO series motherboard (Intel 500s or later), security section is not under BIOS\Settings
1625043355450.png

To verify TPM is enabled in windows, press [Windows]+[R] key, and run "tpm.msc". "TPM Management" will show the TPM version of your system.
1625196442301.png


For more detail information, you can visit Microsoft website.
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/windows-11

TPM 2.0 (fTPM) Compatible Motherboard

MSI Global - The Leading Brand in High-end Gaming & Professional Creation

As a world leading gaming brand, MSI is the most trusted name in gaming and eSports. We stand by our principles of breakthroughs in design, and roll out the amazing gaming gear like motherboards, graphics cards, laptops and desktops.
www.msi.com www.msi.com
This is NOT a Win11 compatible motherboard list, it simply means the motherboard BIOS supports fTPM
Intel
SeriesChipsetCPU Supported
500 SeriesZ590 / B560 / H51010th / 11th Gen
400 SeriesZ490 / B460 / H41010th / 11th Gen
300 SeriesZ390 / Z370 / B365 / B360 / H370 / H3108th / 9th Gen
200 SeriesZ270 / B250 / H2706th / 7th Gen
100 SeriesZ170 / B150 / H170 / H1106th / 7th Gen
X299X299X-series 10000/9000/78xx
AMD
SeriesChipset
500 SeriesX570S / X570 / B550 / A520
400 SeriesX470 / B450
300 SeriesX370 / B350 / A320
TR4 SeriesTRX40 / X399
Link to fTPM BIOS function support motherboard

Unable to boot into operating system once updating to new Windows 11 compatible BIOS
1. Change BIOS\Settings\Advanced\BIOS CSM/UEFI Mode from UEFI to CSM mode
2. Convert storage partition style
3. Change BIOS\Settings\Advanced\BIOS CSM/UEFI Mode from CSM to UEFI mode again
 
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I'm having issues enabling tpm2.0 on the MSI edge z690 ddr4 wifi motherboard....whenever I activate it, the system doesn't allow me to activate xmp (with bios version 1.1 and the new beta 1.2). Also i'm unable to switch off TPM2.0 in bios, whenever I do, the bios freezes ramdomly when I attempt to disable save and exit. Is this a general bios issue that needs ironing out? I've managed to disable by way or reflashing and deactivaing TPM2.0 when the system reboots post flash? Once i've disabled TPM successully, I can then activate XMP etc. and it all works accordingly, Windows boots fine and the system is stable albeit with the help of a slight underclock to CPU (12700k) to around 1.2v, idle voltage with v1.1 bios is ~1.3v a bit high for idle but i digress.

There's so many issues with the bios, luckily i've decades of experience working on systems, if it had have been anyone else they'd be stuck and lost....some help please, I feel i've become a beta tester for a product despite being early adopted, should have some degree of polish....Thanks in advance.
 
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chrispan150302d0 said:
I'm having issues enabling tpm2.0 on the MSI edge z690 ddr4 wifi motherboard....whenever I activate it, the system doesn't allow me to activate xmp (with bios version 1.1 and the new beta 1.2). Also i'm unable to switch off TPM2.0 in bios, whenever I do, the bios freezes ramdomly when I attempt to disable save and exit. Is this a general bios issue that needs ironing out? I've managed to disable by way or reflashing and deactivaing TPM2.0 when the system reboots post flash? Once i've disabled TPM successully, I can then activate XMP etc. and it all works accordingly, Windows boots fine and the system is stable albeit with the help of a slight underclock to CPU (12700k) to around 1.2v, idle voltage with v1.1 bios is ~1.3v a bit high for idle but i digress.

There's so many issues with the bios, luckily i've decades of experience working on systems, if it had have been anyone else they'd be stuck and lost....some help please, I feel i've become a beta tester for a product despite being early adopted, should have some degree of polish....Thanks in advance.
Click to expand...
@citay
 
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Yeah well, more proof that the Z690 BIOS is quite immature and needs at least another two updates or so to be fully usable. I know some people here belong to the fraction of "never change a running system" when it comes to the BIOS updates, but first you have to have a system that is running smoothly in all regards...

This sort of "bananaware" has sadly become the norm. On Intel, it was a bit less pronounced in previous generations, because they hardly changed much about the CPU and chipset generations, so they could partly build on what they had before. But with Z590 and Rocket lake, the first real CPU architectural change since Skylake in 2015, it was already quite problematic at the beginning with the first BIOS. People on AMD might be used to that, there were huge BIOS problems with the first Ryzen generations at the beginning, but for Intel, we hadn't really seen that so much in the six years prior.

Now with Z690, it seems to be even a bit worse in some regards, i hear lots of stories even from other manufacturers about RAM problems with the DDR4 boards in particular. I think it's all mostly because of the immature BIOS. Maybe they worked on the DDR5 stuff too much and neglected the DDR4 boards a little. You can only wait for a BIOS update.
 
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citay said:
Yeah well, more proof that the Z690 BIOS is quite immature and needs at least another two updates or so to be fully usable. I know some people here belong to the fraction of "never change a running system" when it comes to the BIOS updates, but first you have to have a system that is running smoothly in all regards...

This sort of "bananaware" has sadly become the norm. On Intel, it was a bit less pronounced in previous generations, because they hardly changed much about the CPU and chipset generations, so they could partly build on what they had before. But with Z590 and Rocket lake, the first real CPU architectural change since Skylake in 2015, it was already quite problematic at the beginning with the first BIOS. People on AMD might be used to that, there were huge BIOS problems with the first Ryzen generations at the beginning, but for Intel, we hadn't really seen that so much in the six years prior.

Now with Z690, it seems to be even a bit worse in some regards, i hear lots of stories even from other manufacturers about RAM problems with the DDR4 boards in particular. I think it's all mostly because of the immature BIOS. Maybe they worked on the DDR5 stuff too much and neglected the DDR4 boards a little. You can only wait for a BIOS update.
Click to expand...

Agree with you on the immature part, it's evident AND widespread. There wouldn't be a customer out there that isn't experiencing some issue with plug and play ram i.e XMP, not everbody tweaks....i'm all for taking time to build out bios to ensure all permutations are catered for, however instead of releasing a half baked product, delay the release and get the % of completeness up, as it stands it's quite low and so many people are disappointed with the experience so far. The fact that other manufacturers are too, experiencing similar issues, screams slow down and get it right....On that note, I'll attempt with my local area MSI technical team and see what they come up with.

So getting back to it, it sounds as though there's no real idea on what the deal is with my situation and best to sit tight? So therefore, if you want to play games like Valorant for example, which require TPM and secure boot and you're experiencing similar problems enabling TPM in bios, you're screwed....for the time being....the journey continues....
 
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Just an idea, but I wonder if buying an actual tpm module and using that, would make a difference. Would be an interesting experiment if you have the money for it.
 
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laurence1211 said:
Just an idea, but I wonder if buying an actual tpm module and using that, would make a difference. Would be an interesting experiment if you have the money for it.
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If you can find one before all the scalpers grab them use to be about $20 delivered now

And two of these companies I do by from normally they good on price.
1641053137775.png
 
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laurence1211 said:
Nice and cheap down under, I got one last month for £50 and that was the sale price lol. Pricing is very different place to place.
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Same companies before win 11 was announced and needed TPM to work they was under $20 delivered other places are like $40 + $30 delivery now
 
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laurence1211 said:
Just an idea, but I wonder if buying an actual tpm module and using that, would make a difference. Would be an interesting experiment if you have the money for it.
Click to expand...

No I haven't thought of investing further, it's something that should be working day 1 otherwise it's false advertising plain and simple. What should a non tech person be doing if they aren't very knowledgeable? If you can't get it working and it's on the box, it's noted everywhere and the customer can't get it to work, well, the solution isn't fit for purpose....but I can see why people consider workarounds to get things to work, it's also what is feeding all the problems in the industry. They need to be held accountible. I'm after solutions not workarounds.
 
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chrispan150302d0 said:
No I haven't thought of investing further, it's something that should be working day 1 otherwise it's false advertising plain and simple. What should a non tech person be doing if they aren't very knowledgeable? If you can't get it working and it's on the box, it's noted everywhere and the customer can't get it to work, well, the solution isn't fit for purpose....but I can see why people consider workarounds to get things to work, it's also what is feeding all the problems in the industry. They need to be held accountible. I'm after solutions not workarounds.
Click to expand...
It may actually be a solution, personally I think the tpm chips are better than the software tpm options. As for accountability, you could press them on it and return the hardware. Only money talks at the end of the day.
 
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laurence1211 said:
It may actually be a solution, personally I think the tpm chips are better than the software tpm options. As for accountability, you could press them on it and return the hardware. Only money talks at the end of the day.
Click to expand...
Thanks for your help, if hardware TPM does the trick I'll take a look...What are some of the recommended tpm chips available at the above retailers? They would need to be the MSI options i'm assuming?

The below are the two i managed to find would the first option be best to go with since it appears to be newer? Any experience with it to share? Are they compatible and how are they enabled in bios?

1. https://www.scorptec.com.au/product/motherboards/accessories/91579-tpm-2.0-(ms-4462)
2. https://www.scorptec.com.au/product/motherboards/accessories/75213-tpm-2.0-(ms-4136)
 
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chrispan150302d0 said:
Thanks for your help, if hardware TPM does the trick I'll take a look...What are some of the recommended tpm chips available at the above retailers? They would need to be the MSI options i'm assuming?

The below are the two i managed to find would the first option be best to go with since it appears to be newer? Any experience with it to share? Are they compatible and how are they enabled in bios?

1. https://www.scorptec.com.au/product/motherboards/accessories/91579-tpm-2.0-(ms-4462)
2. https://www.scorptec.com.au/product/motherboards/accessories/75213-tpm-2.0-(ms-4136)
Click to expand...
You have to buy the msi version and it has to be ms4462. If you look at the motherboard manual it shows you the spi interface has 12 pins. Ms4462 is the 12 pin version. As for experience to share, after you put in the tpm, you have to enable tpm options first, then reboot for it to be seen. Also I personally don't use xmp, I manually set the rated speed and auto the rest. I find that works better with the click 5 bios.
 
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laurence1211 said:
You have to buy the msi version and it has to be ms4462. If you look at the motherboard manual it shows you the spi interface has 12 pins. Ms4462 is the 12 pin version. As for experience to share, after you put in the tpm, you have to enable tpm options first, then reboot for it to be seen. Also I personally don't use xmp, I manually set the rated speed and auto the rest. I find that works better with the click 5 bios.
Click to expand...

I picked up the ms4462 and all seems to be working ok....the only thing i've noticed related to bios is when I click on the top right cross to exit the system freezes, yet if I press F10 or escape either save or exit without saving that way, all is fine....seems another bug that needs addressing, but besides that, TPM is now operational and also with XMP enabled....will keep an eye on it and see how things go over coming weeks...thanks for the suggestions and help
 
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chrispan150302d0 said:
I picked up the ms4462 and all seems to be working ok....the only thing i've noticed related to bios is when I click on the top right cross to exit the system freezes, yet if I press F10 or escape either save or exit without saving that way, all is fine....seems another bug that needs addressing, but besides that, TPM is now operational and also with XMP enabled....will keep an eye on it and see how things go over coming weeks...thanks for the suggestions and help
Click to expand...
Hopefully the bugs will be straightened out before long. Glad the tpm is working though.
 
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