XPM Problem, need HELP

[stephen_rioblan156802dc]

Good morning,

Once in the bios of my CM Msi I go to pre-save profile 1 which is for overclocking and this activates the XPM of the RAM sticks that I have x4 "RAM Gskill D5 7800 32GB C36 TridentZ Z5 RGB K2" in order to obtain the 7800 MHZ proposed by Gskill.

Unfortunately once I save and I turn on the pc it gives me an error message with a black background saying "Memory Overclock Fail!"

So I would like to know where the problem comes from?
Is it a compatibility issue between the MSI MEG Z790 ACE motherboard and the Gskill D5 7800 32GB C36 TridentZ Z5 RGB K2 RAM sticks?
Or because I have 4 sticks of 16GB RAM? (Total 64gb)
Or BIOS update problem? (I have the latest version though)

I'm stuck at 4000MHZ, it's a shame not to be able to take full advantage of it given the price I paid...

Can you help me ?

Here is my config:

GPU: MSI GeForce RTX 4090 SUPRIM X 24G
CPU: Intel Core i9-13900K CPU
RAM x4 (64gb): RAM Gskill D5 7800 32GB C36 TridentZ Z5 / F5-7800J3646H16GX2-TZ5RSRGB K2
CM: MSI MEG Z790 ACE
SSD: Samsung 990 Pro MZ-V9P2T0BW 1TB
PSU: Cooler Master V1300 Platinum 30th Anniversary
Windows 11 Professional 64bit

Thank you.

 

[f3rmion]

MSI MEG Z790 ACE supports following transfer rates -
Max. overclocking frequency:
• 1DPC 1R Max speed up to 7800+ MHz
• 1DPC 2R Max speed up to 6600+ MHz
• 2DPC 1R Max speed up to 6400+ MHz
• 2DPC 2R Max speed up to 5600+ MHz
You are using all 4 slots (2 DIMMs Per Channel or 2DPC) with 16GB (single rank or 1R) per slot, which makes it 2DPC 1R config. So you are limited to about 6400-6800MT/s in best case scenario. That too depends on IMC quality or silicon lottery of your 13900K along with various other factors like CPU/RAM temps, CPU mounting pressure, etc.
It is already difficult to stabilize 7200MT/s+ on a 4 DIMM motherboard with only 2 DIMMs occupied. In your case, it will be almost impossible to go beyond 6800MT/s even with manual tuning.
So your problems are -
1. You have 4 DIMM board (which have hard time stabilizing beyond 7200+).
2. You are using all 4 slots on the board which increases stress on IMC and reduces you max achievable stable freq.
3. You have unrealistic expectations.
What you can do -
1. You can try fiddling with CPU SA, CPU VDD2, CPU VDDQ, DRAM VDD/VDDQ voltages, if you can spare a couple of weeks trying to stabilize it around 6000-6400MT/s.
2. Reduce your expectations and try to stabilize near 4800-5200MT/s with some changes to DRAM VDD/VDDQ voltages.
3. Use only 2 DIMM slots, with 32GB memory installed and try to stabilize around 7200-7600MT/s.
4. Exchange your kit with a 48GB 7200-8000MT/s kit and try to stabilize around 7600MT/s.
5. Try some beta BIOS for your board with better memory stability like E7D86IMS.141.zip

 

[Nichrome]

You're also mixing your RAM. That's not achievable. 2 kits of "same model" does not account for being exactly the same. F5-7800J3646H16GX2-TZ5RSRGB K2 is a 32GB kit, not 64GB.

 

[stephen_rioblan156802dc]

You're also mixing your RAM. That's not achievable. 2 kits of "same model" does not account for being exactly the same. F5-7800J3646H16GX2-TZ5RSRGB K2 is a 32GB kit, not 64GB.

Hello, thank you for your answer.
You mean that having bought the same 2 pack GSkill RAM strip with 2x16gb RAM which makes a total of 64gb would be a problem for overclocking? Because I bought the same models sold in pairs, I wanted to fill my 4 slots and distribute the memory over 4 16gb strips rather than just 2x32gb for example... So the ideal would be to have only 2x32gb rather than 4x16gb in name the right model compatible with my motherboard?

I found this while researching compatibility. The one I have at 7800 Mhz is therefore not supported by my motherboard for this frequency, so I would need the: G.Skill - F5-7200J3445G16GX2-TZ5RK at 7200 Mhz in order to overclock without problem? Should I take 4x16gb or only 2x32gb? THANKS

 

[Nichrome]

Yes it is a problem for overclocking, and often even for just getting a system stable. While model is the same, all it takes is different batch of transistors to cause the difference and result in instabilities.
There's a reason why there are 4x factory matched kits available. They're hard to match, let alone run at higher frequencies, hence it's usually more expensive to buy single factory matched kit of 4x16GB than 2 kits of 2x16GB.
Ideally, if you need 64GB, you'd want a single kit of 2x32GB. If you need more RAM, then still a single kit of 4x32GB would be a much wiser choice.

 

[stephen_rioblan156802dc]

Yes it is a problem for overclocking, and often even for just getting a system stable. While model is the same, all it takes is different batch of transistors to cause the difference and result in instabilities.
There's a reason why there are 4x factory matched kits available. They're hard to match, let alone run at higher frequencies, hence it's usually more expensive to buy single factory matched kit of 4x16GB than 2 kits of 2x16GB.
Ideally, if you need 64GB, you'd want a single kit of 2x32GB. If you need more RAM, then still a single kit of 4x32GB would be a much wiser choice.

Ok, I did not know that there were packs of 4 barrettes. But I've searched, but I can't find any sold by 4 to get 4x16go... Where could I find some?

 

[stephen_rioblan156802dc]

MSI MEG Z790 ACE prend en charge les taux de transfert suivants -
Max. fréquence d'overclocking :
• 1DPC 1R Vitesse maximale jusqu'à 7800+ MHz
• Vitesse maximale 1DPC 2R jusqu'à 6600+ MHz
• Vitesse maximale 2DPC 1R jusqu'à 6400+ MHz
• Vitesse maximale 2DPC 2R jusqu'à 5600+ MHz
Vous utilisez les 4 emplacements (2 DIMM par canal ou 2DPC) avec 16 Go (rang simple ou 1R) par emplacement, ce qui en fait une configuration 2DPC 1R. Vous êtes donc limité à environ 6400-6800MT/s dans le meilleur des cas. Cela dépend également de la qualité IMC ou de la loterie de silicium de votre 13900K ainsi que de divers autres facteurs tels que les températures CPU/RAM, la pression de montage du CPU, etc.
Il est déjà difficile de stabiliser 7200MT/s+ sur une carte mère 4 DIMM avec seulement 2 DIMM occupés. Dans votre cas, il sera presque impossible d'aller au-delà de 6800MT/s même avec un réglage manuel.
Donc vos problèmes sont -
1. Vous avez 4 cartes DIMM (qui ont du mal à se stabiliser au-delà de 7200+).
2. Vous utilisez les 4 emplacements de la carte, ce qui augmente le stress sur IMC et réduit la fréquence stable maximale réalisable.
3. Vous avez des attentes irréalistes.
Ce que tu peux faire -
1. Vous pouvez essayer de jouer avec les tensions CPU SA, CPU VDD2, CPU VDDQ, DRAM VDD/VDDQ, si vous pouvez épargner quelques semaines en essayant de la stabiliser autour de 6000-6400MT/s.
2. Réduisez vos attentes et essayez de vous stabiliser autour de 4800-5200MT/s avec quelques modifications des tensions DRAM VDD/VDDQ.
3. Utilisez uniquement 2 emplacements DIMM, avec 32 Go de mémoire installés et essayez de vous stabiliser autour de 7200-7600MT/s.
4. Échangez votre kit avec un kit 48GB 7200-8000MT/s et essayez de vous stabiliser autour de 7600MT/s.
5. Essayez un BIOS bêta pour votre carte avec une meilleure stabilité de la mémoire comme E7D86IMS.141.zip
[/CITATION]
Bonjour,
Merci pour votre retour.
Je vais essayer de faire quelques manipulations en gardant le 4x16go afin d'obtenir une meilleure fréquence. Mais vous me dites qu'il suffit d'avoir 2x32go et non 4x16go, sauf si je trouve un pack 4x16go vendu, non ? Sinon je dois prendre un pack 2x32go uniquement ?

 

[Alan J T]

Bubble-busting time, that speed of over 7000 is for only One yes that is it just ONE stick of ram not two or four but just ONE

 

[stephen_rioblan156802dc]

Bubble-busting time, that speed of over 7000 is for only One yes that is it just ONE stick of ram not two or four but just ONE

Ok, so the best and most optimal would be to have only 2x32gb of ram in order to get the best frequency?

And what frequency to take because 7800Mhz will never be reached... A 7200Mhz would be enough or below 7000Mhz?

 

[stephen_rioblan156802dc]

Bubble-busting time, that speed of over 7000 is for only One yes that is it just ONE stick of ram not two or four but just ONE

Or I can adjust the frequency in the bios and lower it manually to 7000Mhz in order to be able to launch the XMP?

 

[Alan J T]

Ok, so the best and most optimal would be to have only 2x32gb of ram in order to get the best frequency?

And what frequency to take because 7800Mhz will never be reached... A 7200Mhz would be enough or below 7000Mhz?

No 2 by 8GB or two x16 single-sided would be the best bet at that speed bigger the Ram modules the less chance of running at that speed. most 32GB sticks are Double Sided

 

[stephen_rioblan156802dc]

No 2 by 8GB or two x16 single-sided would be the best bet at that speed bigger the Ram modules the less chance of running at that speed. most 32GB sticks are Double Sided

Alright, thanks for that clarification. Currently there is therefore no point in putting 4 DDR5 RAM strips if I understand correctly? Since I currently have 4x16gb at 7800Mhz, would it be best if I removed a pack to keep only 2x16gb?

 

[Alan J T]

I would try first you may get very lucky and get 6800 or 7000 all depends on how good your CPU is but over that very very unlikely
Start with two sticks and then try four.

 

[stephen_rioblan156802dc]

I would try first you may get very lucky and get 6800 or 7000 all depends on how good your CPU is but over that very very unlikely
Start with two sticks and then try four.

To check and do tests on the frequency with only 2X16go is the CPU-Z software ideal or is there other software to measure the frequency? Because I went into my bios and I was able to activate XPM with 7200 Mhz. But how to check?

 

[Alan J T]

CPUZ or Zen Timings

 

[f3rmion]

With 2x32GB, it will be 1DPC 2R config with max speed up to 6600+ MHz.
Your best bet is to either run 2x16GB config with your current kit or get G.Skill 2x24GB 7200 or 7600 kits.
For quick stability testing, you can use y-cruncher Pi 2.5b benchmark with HWiNFO64 open to monitor CPU/RAM temps and WHEAs (windows hardware errors).
For extensive testing you can use Testmem 5, y-cruncher VST, etc., but always keep an eye on temps.

 

[f3rmion]

To check and do tests on the frequency with only 2X16go is the CPU-Z software ideal or is there other software to measure the frequency? Because I went into my bios and I was able to activate XPM with 7200 Mhz. But how to check?

You can use CPU-Z or AIDA64 to check. Even windows task manager can show your current running frequency.

 

[keith3_16]

To be fair, half the time XMP OCing is pointless.

Take these test results, OC'ed vs not OCed.
UserBenchmarks: Game 159%, Desk 108%, Work 147%
CPU: Intel Core i5-11600K - 102.4%
GPU: Nvidia RTX 3070 - 155.3%
SSD: WD Blue SN570 NVMe PCIe M.2 500GB - 214.1%
SSD: WDC WDS500G2B0A-00SM50 500GB - 94.1%
SSD: WDS100T1X0E-00AFY0 1TB - 427.2%
HDD: Samsung Spinpoint F2 1TB - 47%
HDD: Seagate Expansion HDD 2TB - 60.8%
RAM: Corsair CMH16GX4M2Z3600C18 4x8GB - 121.7%
MBD: MSI MPG Z590 GAMING PLUS (MS-7D07)

UserBenchmarks: Game 151%, Desk 103%, Work 141%
CPU: Intel Core i5-11600K - 96.4%
GPU: Nvidia RTX 3070 - 156%
SSD: WD Blue SN570 NVMe PCIe M.2 500GB - 212.8%
SSD: WDC WDS500G2B0A-00SM50 500GB - 96.7%
SSD: WDS100T1X0E-00AFY0 1TB - 438.5%
HDD: Samsung Spinpoint F2 1TB - 42.9%
HDD: Seagate Expansion HDD 2TB - 60.9%
RAM: Corsair CMH16GX4M2Z3600C18 4x8GB - 90.9%
MBD: MSI MPG Z590 GAMING PLUS (MS-7D07)

These are the results of just XMP OCing the RAM.

UserBenchmarks: Game 133%, Desk 97%, Work 121%
CPU: Intel Core i5-11600K - 89.5%
GPU: Nvidia RTX 3070 - 145.6%
SSD: WD Blue SN570 NVMe PCIe M.2 500GB - 175.5%
SSD: WDC WDS500G2B0A-00SM50 500GB - 87.6%
SSD: WDS100T1X0E-00AFY0 1TB - 413.1%
HDD: Samsung Spinpoint F2 1TB - 48.9%
HDD: Seagate Expansion HDD 2TB - 61.1%
RAM: Corsair CMH16GX4M2Z3600C18 4x8GB - 116%
MBD: MSI MPG Z590 GAMING PLUS (MS-7D07)

as you can see, you are better off fully OCing or leaving stock clocks. just OCing the RAM give my system the worst performance out of the 3 set ups.

 

[stephen_rioblan156802dc]

To be fair, half the time XMP OCing is pointless.

Take these test results, OC'ed vs not OCed.
UserBenchmarks: Game 159%, Desk 108%, Work 147%
CPU: Intel Core i5-11600K - 102.4%
GPU: Nvidia RTX 3070 - 155.3%
SSD: WD Blue SN570 NVMe PCIe M.2 500GB - 214.1%
SSD: WDC WDS500G2B0A-00SM50 500GB - 94.1%
SSD: WDS100T1X0E-00AFY0 1TB - 427.2%
HDD: Samsung Spinpoint F2 1TB - 47%
HDD: Seagate Expansion HDD 2TB - 60.8%
RAM: Corsair CMH16GX4M2Z3600C18 4x8GB - 121.7%
MBD: MSI MPG Z590 GAMING PLUS (MS-7D07)

UserBenchmarks: Game 151%, Desk 103%, Work 141%
CPU: Intel Core i5-11600K - 96.4%
GPU: Nvidia RTX 3070 - 156%
SSD: WD Blue SN570 NVMe PCIe M.2 500GB - 212.8%
SSD: WDC WDS500G2B0A-00SM50 500GB - 96.7%
SSD: WDS100T1X0E-00AFY0 1TB - 438.5%
HDD: Samsung Spinpoint F2 1TB - 42.9%
HDD: Seagate Expansion HDD 2TB - 60.9%
RAM: Corsair CMH16GX4M2Z3600C18 4x8GB - 90.9%
MBD: MSI MPG Z590 GAMING PLUS (MS-7D07)

These are the results of just XMP OCing the RAM.

UserBenchmarks: Game 133%, Desk 97%, Work 121%
CPU: Intel Core i5-11600K - 89.5%
GPU: Nvidia RTX 3070 - 145.6%
SSD: WD Blue SN570 NVMe PCIe M.2 500GB - 175.5%
SSD: WDC WDS500G2B0A-00SM50 500GB - 87.6%
SSD: WDS100T1X0E-00AFY0 1TB - 413.1%
HDD: Samsung Spinpoint F2 1TB - 48.9%
HDD: Seagate Expansion HDD 2TB - 61.1%
RAM: Corsair CMH16GX4M2Z3600C18 4x8GB - 116%
MBD: MSI MPG Z590 GAMING PLUS (MS-7D07)

as you can see, you are better off fully OCing or leaving stock clocks. just OCing the RAM give my system the worst performance out of the 3 set ups.

Good morning,

Thank you for your return with all these details!

So if I understood correctly, the OC only of RAM is useless because we lose more than we gain (in view of the last Benchmarks that you left, of the XMP OCing of RAM)

On the other hand it becomes interesting if I have all OC, ie the gpu, cpu and the ram is that right?
If so, how to proceed with any OC? Because in my bios or via MSI Center 'User Scenario' I can OC the XMP ram and the CPU and for the GPU I have to use MSI Afterburner?

I await your return, thanking you for knowing how to proceed in order to be able to take full advantage of my components.

 

[keith3_16]

Good morning,

Thank you for your return with all these details!

So if I understood correctly, the OC only of RAM is useless because we lose more than we gain (in view of the last Benchmarks that you left, of the XMP OCing of RAM)

On the other hand it becomes interesting if I have all OC, ie the gpu, cpu and the ram is that right?
If so, how to proceed with any OC? Because in my bios or via MSI Center 'User Scenario' I can OC the XMP ram and the CPU and for the GPU I have to use MSI Afterburner?

I await your return, thanking you for knowing how to proceed in order to be able to take full advantage of my components.

Yes you'd have to use Afterburner, I didn't OC my GPU as i wanted a constant to see how OCing the CPU and RAM would have on the system.