Z790 Godlike - iGPU

Joined
Jan 21, 2023
Messages
5
Hello,

Could someone clarify whether using igpu from CPU is possible on z790 Godlike somehow. I am lost in specsheet and I really need to use my second monitor off the CPU.
 
Some say i9-KS series can run igpu on a Z790 Msi Godlike motherboard - not like KF series but i am not sure

No, 13900KS is nothing special, 13900KS is a 13900K that was binned for 3.5% higher peak turbo clocks (+200 MHz) and is sold for 20-25% more money.
As i already replied here, the GODLIKE doesn't power the iGPU part of the CPU at all, there is no way to use it. Luckily, AVX2 doesn't depend on the iGPU, so you should be good.

Why do you want to get the Godlike may I know? complete waste of money. Even the ACE is overkill but it's your money anyway....

Agreed. Even with unlimited funds i wouldn't get it. I've said it all the time, even in this thread: If there's no MSI UNIFY-X board model (or at least UNIFY), then the ACE model is the highest one i'd go for if you want to a really high-end board from MSI. Also see here.

It's better to get a board that sells in bigger volumes and uses the most reasonable high-end parts (and amount of them). By getting a more commonly sold board model, there will be a far bigger number of users providing bug reports and other feedback to MSI to hopefully help them sort out any issues. And it's not like buying a Bugatti, where you can basically call them at any time of day and they will take care of you. The GODLIKE, you pay through the nose for it once, and then you're just another MSI customer.
 
Hi again its client version
i want to use desktop version to be tested please check again
1676373628876.png
 
Thanks a lot - Advanced Vector Extensions (AVX2) are extensions to the x86 instruction set architecture for microprocessors from Intel (i9 Intel processors support the set) so more or less regarding the igpu support the msi z790 ACE and Godlike are the same
so that doesnt effect AVX2 instruction set usage
 
Thanks a lot - Advanced Vector Extensions (AVX2) are extensions to the x86 instruction set architecture for microprocessors from Intel (i9 Intel processors support the set) so more or less regarding the igpu support the msi z790 ACE and Godlike are the same
so that doesnt effect AVX2 instruction set usage

Sorry for the delay. It's running just fine
AnyDesk_99MCGX8wDU.png
AnyDesk_99MCGX8wDU.png
 
@cagrgoncule15c802e9 but as others here have pointed out, the Godlike MB is really overpriced and overkill. I purchased it because I was A) time constrained and B) other options weren't available where I am.

If there's one good thing that came out of it it's that running 128GB RAM with XMP 1 on the Godlike works like a breeze. But other than that it's really overpriced and, worse, in my case I had to pay extra for import fees through my company.
 
Hi Citay,
Would like your opinion please as i know nothing about motherboards, treat me as beginner.

Im building a PC with one of the PC builder retailers Scan uk, mainly my PC will be used for rendering 3d graphics and all 3d softwares for creating an texting 3D assets: 3Ds Max, Zbrush, UE5, adobe Substance Designer and World Machine which is one of the biggest CPU consumer when building 3d heightmaps to create 3d worlds , and on the side will be making some video tutorials on YouTube.

I have everything ready, except the motherboard.
Case Corsair iCUE 5000T RGB White
CPU i913900ks
ROG Strix GeForce RTX 4090 24GB GDDR6X White OC Edition
Corsair iCUE H150i ELITE LCD XT White 360mm CPU Liquid Cooler
64GB (2x32GB) Corsair DDR5 Vengeance Black, PC5-52800 (6600) (64GB seems to be enough for now but may upgrade 128 next year if i see im using the whole 64)
2 x 2TB M.2 990 pro for OS and 3d data (will be using m.2 Gen 5 once its out this year)
4TB Seagate FireCuda 530, M.2 for none active data
1200W Corsair HX1200 (was told 1200w should be enough, but also told should go for 1500w instead to be in safe side, not sure if i need the 1500w here?)
Monitor i use a 49" curved Odyssey G7 which i split on 2 screens

Last is the Motherboard which i cant decide or find yet. My plan was to go for a creator motherboard with m.2 5th Gen slot ready when they come out and a 10GB Ethernet port which i will be used for a NAS to keep my data rolling on a backup all the time to avoid data loss

The Asus Proart z790 was a perfect fit as it include enough m.2 slots and a 10gb port but downside was no m.2 5th ready slot. The Asus M Extreme then become may go as i was told this will be perfect for my setup and it include 5th gen m.2 slot + 10GB Ethernet, sadly Scan uk told me they were informed by the vendor its going End of Life (pretty strange for a new Mobo that just came out few months ago, but retailer insisted this is what they heard from their vendors)
Was looking around for any other mobo that fit my criteria and the only one i found was MS Godlike which is very similar to the Asus M Extreme and its available on stock, but after doing some research I heard it does not have IGPU support and some other critics, which made me wonder if this something i require or not. My knowledge on hardware is very basic and im only very good in the app layer.

Do you reckon i should wait for Asus M Extreme if this end of life story is not true or maybe if they have something new coming out soon, or Godlike is the only way to go
 
I wouldn't get so hung up about onboard 10GBit LAN. The beauty of motherboards is that they support PCIe cards which can add a lot of functionality you require. A simple 10GBit LAN PCIe adapter such as this, using pretty much the same LAN chip as on the Z790 GODLIKE, can be had from under 100 EUR/USD. And it immediately frees you up to several more board models.

Now, if you want a PCIe 5.0 x4 M.2 slot, you could also look at the MSI MPG Z790 Carbon WIFI or Z790 Ace, or the ASUS ROG Strix Z790-E Gaming WIFI. This saves you many hundreds of bucks compared to GODLIKE, even with the 10GBit LAN PCIe adapter factored in.

As for the PSU, if we take into account the ridiculously high power consumption of an unleashed 13900KS (~350W, which even Intel admitted and MSI confirmed is uncoolable, so it's better to restrict it to 250W or so), the equally ridiculous 450W of the 4090, and the rest of the components including the board (let's say 100W), then we arrive at about 900W if everything is fully loaded in an unlimited state, and 800W if we apply a sane power limit. So even a 1000W PSU would be sufficient, if you select the proper one.

The main reason that they used to recommend a hugely powerful PSU with a GPU of that caliber is the transient loads (short bursts of higher power draw beyond the TDP wattage) that especially the GeForce 3000-series was known for, which could make some lesser PSUs shut down because the overcurrent protection (OCP) was tripped. But with the 4000-series they got the transients much better under control.

Also, there are new ATX 3.0-compliant PSUs out now, which have much higher tolerance for transient loads. With such PSUs, you don't need to completely overspec them at all anymore, they won't shut down on you. As an added benefit, those PSUs come with a native 12VHPWR cable, so you don't have to use an adapter cable from several conventional 8-pin PCIe power cables anymore. But: High-end ATX 3.0 PSU models are still rare. You have a bunch of 80PLUS Gold ones such as from MSI, but at the high-end range there is currently only one contender, luckily it's a good one that i would recommend. So if that PSU is available in your region, it would be worth considering. It can safely handle your hardware. More in my PSU thread.

64GB (2x32GB) Corsair DDR5 Vengeance Black, PC5-52800 (6600) (64GB seems to be enough for now but may upgrade 128 next year if i see im using the whole 64)

Here i have to link my RAM thread. Once you would upgrade to 4x 32 GB, the DDR5-6600 would probably become out of reach. DDR5 signal quality degrades significantly when using four modules, so much so that a previously stable XMP speed suddenly becomes unattainable and you have to settle for something in the DDR5-5xxx range or so.

When you really have software that requires >64 GB, it should still be better to add more RAM than to not be able to run it properly. But just be aware that once you have all RAM slots populated, the memory system is suddenly twice as stressed and cannot reach its previous heights anymore.
 
Well, i'd get an MSI, then i could help you further. I'm not active on the ASUS forums as i currently don't own one of their boards, but i have several MSI boards here.
I would get the MSI MPG Z790 Carbon WIFI, it has anything you'd want from a board in normal ATX size. Pair it with a 10GBit LAN PCIe adapter, disable the onboard LAN, and you're golden. As for the PSU, that would be the "be quiet! Dark Power 13 1000W".
 
Thanks for you feedback.
I looked for all possible options but unfortunately Carbon will not work for me due to lack of Thunderbolt which i need, so i decided to go for my 1st MSI motherboard and switch from Asus which will be MEG Z790 ACE
After doing some research today I will be dropping the 10GB use for my NAS setup due to complications of the speed, since not all NAS support 10GB and going thunderbolt for NAS its same issue not all support it and turn out to be very expensive.
My goal is to have windows file history on, so every 10 minute my OS will be writing back data to an external drive. NAS as explained will be too slow to write bunch of GBs every 10 minutes which will cause unnecessary wait time and load on my PC that will affect the overall performance, instead i was looking for an external M.2 SSD where GBs of data can be copied quickly in few secs without any IO wait time. This option also turned to be problematic, using m.2 as external is good idea, but nothing out there with reasonable price offers reasonable cooling to a busy drive. Most affordable external m.2 using thunderbolt 4 offer max 2TB support and a simple cooling thermal.
I was thinking the best place for an m.2 to be active all time and take advantage from cooling is on the motherboard it self and it will also be best place for max speed transfer of data (for Windows file history requiring external drive its easy to configure an internal drive to look external to windows). I know its good to have a copy of your data outside of your PC, but that not a problem. I can still use an external normal SSD and make a copy once a every few days, as long as the main 10 minute file backup have best spot this should be fine.

Now I have 2 questions for you please, considering 1x2TB m.2 990 pro for OS, apps and some data + 2nd 2TB 990 for extra data + 3rd 1x4TB Seagate firecuda m.2 used for file backup. Total 3 SSDs 2 / 2 / 4 (gen5 m.2 will become primary for OS once its out)

1 - where it should be the best place to place each of these 3x PCIE4 m.2s, does the slots on motherboard matter and is there like primary and 2ndary slots? is there slots which benefit from extra cooling? (I read for example in Asus 790 extreme review that if m.2 is placed next to the GPU slot it share bandwidth with the GPU PCIE and also same for some other motherboard )
I can see same for this motherboard
1677202511232.png



Does this mean i need to set my M.2 like this ?

1677201304550.png


2 - Is it worth to buy a heatsink for my backup drive 1x4TB Seagate firecuda and will it fit in this motherboard? or its not worth it

Thanks in advance
 
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Now I have 2 questions for you please, considering 1x2TB m.2 990 pro for OS, apps and some data + 2nd 2TB 990 for extra data + 3rd 1x4TB Seagate firecuda m.2 used for file backup. Total 3 SSDs 2 / 2 / 4 (gen5 m.2 will become primary for OS once its out)

Make sure to install Samsung Magician and apply the firmware update to the 990 PRO SSDs, first thing. See here, https://www.tomshardware.com/news/samsung-990-pro-firmware-update-released-ssd-health

I have a 990 PRO myself for my new system, and already performed the firmware update on another PC before even installing Windows.

1 - where it should be the best place to place each of these 3x PCIE4 m.2s, does the slots on motherboard matter and is there like primary and 2ndary slots? is there slots which benefit from extra cooling? (I read for example in Asus 790 extreme review that if m.2 is placed next to the GPU slot it share bandwidth with the GPU PCIE and also same for some other motherboard )

Two M.2 slots get their PCIe lanes from the CPU and can be considered the "primary" ones, M2_1 and M2_4, with the M2_4 also being the PCIe 5.0 compatible one.
There is no lane sharing with the first PCIe slot. edit: That was wrong. I updated the picture of the slots.

Then there is another thing to consider: Your 4090, like a lot of GPUs, pushes hot air out mostly to the sides:

air.jpg


If you look at where the first PCIe slot is, then M2_2 bears the brunt of that heat towards the board's side, with M2_3 also catching a bit of it.
So these M.2 slots i would use last.

Then we come to this conclusion:

z790.png


All the M.2 slots have heatsinks for the SSDs, no need to purchase any. Just make sure you install the SSDs and heatsinks as they say in the manual, and don't forget to peel off the protective film from the thermal pads under the heatsinks.
 
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So M2_1 lane i will be using for OS for now and M2_4 lane will be 2ndary data until Gen5 M.2 come out then M2_4 lane will become my main OS.

However my concerns here are this
*PCI_E1 slot will run at x8 speed when installing device in the PCI_E2 slot or M2_4 slot.
**M2_4 slot will be unavailable when installing device in the PCI_E2 slot.


Having a 2ndary data M.2 in M2_4 lane will not affect the RTX or M.2 performance ? as RTX sits in PCI_E1 slot which mean the SSD Gen4 M.2 now and later Gen5 M.2 share the bandwidth with the GPU

Just make sure you install the SSDs and heatsinks as they say in the manual, and don't forget to peel off the protective film from the thermal pads under the heatsinks.
Thanks good idea here.
The link you provided if for the software which need an OS running to be able to install it. do you have the link for the package that can be installed by a USB via the bios before i install Windows
 
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Oh sorry, you are right, there is lane sharing going on between PCIe slot 1 and M2_4. I somehow thought it was PCIe slot 2.
The 4090 is PCIe 4.0 x16, and it will be running at PCIe 4.0 x8 with a PCIe SSD in M2_4. But that's still equivalent to PCIe 3.0 x16, so the performance loss is only around 2% or so.

Plus it sounds like you are definitely eyeing those upcoming PCIe 5.0 SSDs (some of which are gonna come with big coolers, even with a fan), and those will need to be using M2_4 if you want to benefit from the higher linear thruput rates.

About the 990 PRO: I simply popped it into another system's M.2 slot, ran Samsung Magician there and updated it. You can install Windows first, that's no big deal. Just make sure to do the firmware update pretty soon afterwards.

The order with a new board / system is like this (for me at least):
1) Install everything, then a quick basic stability test using Memtest86 Free. Prepare a USB stick with Memtest86 and boot from it by pressing F11 for the boot menu after a reboot. Enable XMP for this before testing.
2) Update the BIOS to the newest version. Then enable XMP again and set up your fan curves.
3) Install Windows.
4) Install Intel Chipset drivers first, then Serial I/O and Management Engine (all from the MSI support site). These will get rid of all the unknown devices in the device manager and set everything up correctly for the power saving modes to work and so on. Also LAN driver, let Windows Update check for missing updates. Reboot will be needed.
5) Around now you can install Samsung Magician and do the firmware update. Then go to the settings and remove it from Autostart. Check every couple months for a new firmware update manually.

Some drivers you can get from Intel directly if they are newer (and they often are, for example the WLAN and BT drivers):
Intel Graphics: https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/download/19344/intel-graphics-windows-dch-drivers.html
LAN: https://www.intel.com/content/www/u...el-network-adapter-driver-for-windows-10.html (Wired driver x64)
WLAN (Driver64) and Bluetooth.
 
Thanks lots for your help, as this lead me to understand few things which i wasn't paying attention to before.
You are absolutely right about the Gen5 M.2, I'm spending 5k-6k for a PC and of course nobody will want to buy a PC and in few months end up with a mobo which cant use next Gen SSDs, My last PC lasted for 7 years and until last year my i7 and GTX Pascal Edition with 1st Gen M.2 were doing well working with 3D programs. But now with Raytracing im left behind and its time to upgrade for a PC which need to last for at least 5-6 years.

Now when it come to having a M.2 Lane sharing bandwidth with the GPU is a BIG NO for me, we know actual games do not use all potential of the PCIe 5 x16 bandwidth because they are optimized and if you do buy PC just to play games i dont recommend any Creator Motherboard, a 2.5K pc should do the job. Because the difference of your GPU sharing bandwidth with M.2 and running on x8 instead of x16 its not huge, as per tests done here its a maximin of 10% performance loss. For actual games its not an issue. (note: for future games in few years it will be an issue)
However when you're a creator and make 3D environments and assets for games you are never running on the optimal performance, as this is last step done when polishing. Usually your scene is always upside down and full of millions polys around you, while for example on optimized game you are running on a scene with 7 million polygons, the original scene can be 20 times bigger or just one high poly asset you're working one can be 100mil polys which is bigger than an optimized game scene. plus you are rendering every few minutes your while environment leading to CPU, GPU and M.2 bottleneck many times per day as each render a GBs of cache are written in cache folders. So its very different than a final game which come optimized with cache ready installed on your Blu-ray.
There will be also an increase in the future of the bandwidth used actually by the Gen5 M.2 and potential increase on the next GPUs either via updates or new GPUs version.

I spent all day yesterday researching all mobos Asus, MSI and Gigabyte with Gen5 M.2 ready and they all steal bandwidth from your GPU if you use an Gen5 M.2 including the expensive Maximus extreme. except one Motherboard which have dedicated 2nd PCIE for your M.2 Godlike

1677361466428.png


You may say but other Mobos have 2nd PCEI 5 and can be used for M.2 like the case of Z790 Apex. Yes its true but they all still share bandwidth with the 1st PCIE for your GPU even from the 2nd PCIE, that's why Godlike is the only exception

1677361278918.png


In Regards to the down side of this mobo mentioned in many forums and YouTube videos not supporting IGPU which make it useless for Creators due to media encoding , after looking closely at this its really not true. Nvidia support H.264/HEVC decoding, and H.264/HEVC encoding which are much better than the intel encoder.
I even checked Premier Pro users in few forums and find out people even disable the IGPU to force software use GPU instead as it goes much faster for them. like this comment from Here:
I found that disabling Intel for video decode works out much better in my case (4090). Results are night and day, I can edit and playback without stutter which makes for smoother workflow and lower times. 13900K just wasn’t cutting it for me here

There is nothing an iGPU can do which GPU cannot, if someone is buying this board to use it without a GPU is like buying a Ferrari and to just walk around with the key.

Godlike is an expensive motherboard for sure i'm not a hardware expert to know exactly how much it cost them to build it. But i will say looking at all the features and expansion it provides as a Creator motherboard roughly £1000 max instead of 1.2K . If we drop all the fancy unnecessary gadgets they can make a similar motherboard for £800.
In the other hand Maximus Extreme its really not worth it.

Conclusion if you're a Creator Godlike is the only way to go as you have no other choices as of today since its the only one supporting next Gen5 SSD without sacrificing your GPU lane, otherwise if you pick up any other mobo you will need to upgrade in few months and will be waste of money.
 
They are listed here under OC - "Advanced CPU Configuration" in the BIOS, Long and Short duration power limit just above CPU Lite Load:

MSI_MPG_Z690_CARBON_WIFI_063_6A95423C9280435BBBA03EAB5EC26E37.jpg


So you could set Long and Short Duration Power Limit to 253W there for a test, just to see if it impacts the score a lot, and of course how the temperatures are. I would also set "C1E Support" to Enabled.

We can assume it affects the CB23 score a little though, because that uses fully multithreaded AVX load which is known to be very demanding. That doesn't have to mean that it affects your daily tasks though, if they make the CPU work below or around that level of power consumption anyway.

Hi @citay. I am someone else who has built a system with Z790 Godlike and an I9-13900KS 😁I am laughing to myself after reading all your comments about those two parts... but anyways, I have my reasons for having building the system, but anyways...

I am also struggling a little bit on keeping the KS cooled with my MSI Liquidcore S360 and I came into this discussion and saw your suggestions on changing the CPU Lite Load and Long and Short Duration Power. My system is running stable within Mode 5, which it seems to be good since someone else with a similar setup has mentioned not able to get stability below Mode 6.

I wanted to try Long and Short Duration Power too, looking for the best efficiency. However both Long and Short Duration Power options are set to [Auto] and they are disabled, I mean I can't change or select a different value from [Auto]. Do you have any ideas on if/what other options would make them unavailable?

Just in case:
------------------
System Information
------------------
Product Name: MEG Z790 GODLIKE
OS: Microsoft Windows 11 Enterprise 64-bit Ver.2009 (OS build 22621.1413)
BIOS Version: 1.20
BIOS Release Date: 01/06/2023
CPU: 13th Gen Intel(R) Core(TM) i9-13900KS
Memory: 128 GB @
- 32 GB DDR5-5600, G Skill Intl F5-6400J3239G32G
- 32 GB DDR5-5600, G Skill Intl F5-6400J3239G32G
- 32 GB DDR5-5600, G Skill Intl F5-6400J3239G32G
- 32 GB DDR5-5600, G Skill Intl F5-6400J3239G32G
Graphics: RTX 4090 SUPRIM LIQUID 24G Series, 24564 MB
Drive: SSD, WD_BLACK SN850X 2000GB, 1863.02 GB
Drive: HDD, Backup+ Hub BK, 5589.03 GB
Drive: SSD, WD_BLACK SN850X 2000GB, 1863.02 GB
Drive: HDD, Backup+ Hub BK, 7452.04 GB
 
I wanted to try Long and Short Duration Power too, looking for the best efficiency. However both Long and Short Duration Power options are set to [Auto] and they are disabled, I mean I can't change or select a different value from [Auto].

Hmm, that's odd. Can you make a screenshot of that BIOS page (either press F12, save to FAT32 drive and convert to PNG for lower size, or make a photo)?
 
I have a Godlike z790 and 13900ks, when you're saying you're struggling to keep the CPU cooled, what is the CPU temp you're having when running light to normal programs, and what's the temp when you run a load on all cores by using a 3d rendering app or some load test like Cinebench?
 
With a 13900KS running unrestricted, in CB23 he might shoot to >300W, which is becoming very hard to deal with even for a capable 360 AIO like the MEG CoreLiquid S360.
 
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