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Author Topic: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum  (Read 16904 times)

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gabmambTopic starter

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Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« on: 21-February-08, 17:36:35 »

hi to everyone, I am writing from italy, I apologise for my english.

I succeded in booting up my motherboard but only if I put my memory stick in dimm3 and dimm4 (for dual channel) or only in dimm3 (if single channel); why?
the user guide tells to populate the dimm1 (green, nearest the cpu) first!!!!

however the motherboard boots up, and the set up runs.

but I noticed another problem, that you can see in the image:



something is "missing", broken....
do you know what is it?
what does it?
is possible to replace it with something else?
and why the motherboard boots up anyway???? :bonk: ???
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Quentin2

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #1 on: 21-February-08, 18:29:26 »

Sounds like there's something wrong with Slot 1, so in that case you can use the outside slots. I've bought quite a few as-is or "dead" K8N Neo2s from ebay and got them all to work but one errors in Memtest if I use the two inside slots yet runs error free if I use the two on the outside.

I hope someone else has better news but I'd guess the missing capacitor is a big problem. Is the system 100% stable like this? I have no idea what it's used for but this can't be good. I suppose there is some redundancy built in but I'd be worried with a cap sheared off like that. I don't know how successful you'd be trying to solder a replacement one back on if you could find one of the right capacity. These two problems may be a good reason to RMA the board if MSI has a good RMA policy in Europe. Unfortunately the board is at least 3 years old so there may be no return policy now.

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gabmambTopic starter

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #2 on: 22-February-08, 09:13:43 »

i have bought it on ebay.... :undecided: :bonk:
but "he" said it was 100% good! >:(
i hate ebay...
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #3 on: 22-February-08, 10:07:13 »

I have asked MSI for the part to give the numbers.
I should have it on Monday, then you can solder a new part in.
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gabmambTopic starter

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #4 on: 22-February-08, 10:56:02 »

I have asked MSI for the part to give the numbers.
I should have it on Monday, then you can solder a new part in.


really?!?!?!?!?!?! :shocked_anim: :shocked_anim: :shocked_anim:
thank you VERY MUCH! :biggthumbsup: :biggthumbsup: :biggthumbsup: :agrees:
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #5 on: 22-February-08, 11:53:41 »

That's no problem, they will simply look at the schematics :lol_anim:
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Quentin2

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #6 on: 22-February-08, 13:21:14 »

That would be really great if you can get the capacitor! If that's fixed I don't think you need to worry much about the bad RAM slot...
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gabmambTopic starter

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #7 on: 22-February-08, 14:35:49 »

That would be really great if you can get the capacitor! If that's fixed I don't think you need to worry much about the bad RAM slot...

yes, i think so too! :yes:
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LairdDrambeg

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #8 on: 22-February-08, 19:38:47 »

For the RAM slot, have you checked a single DIMM in both "bad" slots to see if it's only one that's bad?  Check the metal contacts to see if any are bent, even slightly and you could also try cleaning with the corner of a piece of folded paper with some solvent, e.g. alcohol, on it.  Sometimes just inserting and removing a DIMM 2/3 times will wipe the contacts clean.

For the missing capacitor, have you checked inside the anti-static bag of the mbrd to see if the cap is in the bottom?  I've seen that a couple of times with PCBs - recently found it with a hard disk, where a cap had been ripped off.  In the mean time check out some of the relevant forums for surface mount soldering - it can be tricky: you really need a third hand one to hold the device and the other two to do the work.
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gabmambTopic starter

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #9 on: 23-February-08, 05:56:20 »

For the RAM slot, have you checked a single DIMM in both "bad" slots to see if it's only one that's bad?  Check the metal contacts to see if any are bent, even slightly and you could also try cleaning with the corner of a piece of folded paper with some solvent, e.g. alcohol, on it.  Sometimes just inserting and removing a DIMM 2/3 times will wipe the contacts clean.

well, i think the first hangs everything.
because i used once the second (purple) slot combined with the first and the motherboard did not start.
think that the vendor tells that is only an incompatibility with the ram..... :angryfire:

Quote
For the missing capacitor, have you checked inside the anti-static bag of the mbrd to see if the cap is in the bottom?  I've seen that a couple of times with PCBs - recently found it with a hard disk, where a cap had been ripped off.  In the mean time check out some of the relevant forums for surface mount soldering - it can be tricky: you really need a third hand one to hold the device and the other two to do the work.

it is really hard becase i put in and out the motherboard several times....however i will see.
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LairdDrambeg

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #10 on: 23-February-08, 13:40:08 »

well, i think the first hangs everything.
because i used once the second (purple) slot combined with the first and the motherboard did not start.
think that the vendor tells that is only an incompatibility with the ram..... :angryfire:
If the two DIMMs work in the 3/4 slot I hardly think they are "incompatible" with the mbrd.  You need to be sure what the situation is: try a single DIMM in the 1st slot and then a single DIMM in the 2nd slot.
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gabmambTopic starter

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #11 on: 24-February-08, 04:12:29 »

it is my idea!!
i already have done that test and the only way the motherboard works is installing dimms in 3/4 slots!

the vendor is.......BIIIIIIIIIIIIP!  :hypocrite: :angryfire:
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Quentin2

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #12 on: 24-February-08, 15:44:31 »

I agree with LairdDrambeg. If the RAM was incompatible you'd have problems in the outer slots too.

My ebay K8N Neo2 that had Memtest86+ errors when two sticks of 512MB were in slots 1&2 it didn't matter if I reseated them or swapped them, still had errors. When I moved the two sticks to 3&4 no errors at all, even overnight. I should have investigated the problem further but no longer have easy access to that motherboard however it has worked great for months with RAM in the outer two slots. If I had the time I'd try to clean the inside slots. As I remember it was slot 2 that was the problem no matter which stick of RAM was inserted - not that that has any bearing on your board.
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gabmambTopic starter

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #13 on: 24-February-08, 16:01:07 »

i succeeded (is correct?  :think:) in installing windows xp sp2, with the last drivers but the audio frontal line does not work!!!!! :waiting:

i think that capacitor is the problem; do you?

 :wall: :angryfire:
i have paid it 52 euros!!!! :bonk:
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #14 on: 25-February-08, 02:56:45 »

Hi,

Here you have the info about c224, it's a capacitor of 104pF.
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gabmambTopic starter

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #15 on: 25-February-08, 14:33:21 »

Hi,

Here you have the info about c224, it's a capacitor of 104pF.


excuse me, is an english or european misure/standard?
did you have it from MSI tech?
thank you!
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HenryW

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #16 on: 25-February-08, 15:01:13 »

 But Bas it's C244 not C224 or is that a typo?

 Electronic component measures such as capacitance in pf, resistance in ohms & inductance in henry's is the same no matter where in the world you are.
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #17 on: 25-February-08, 15:32:42 »

But Bas it's C244 not C224 or is that a typo?

 Electronic component measures such as capacitance in pf, resistance in ohms & inductance in henry's is the same no matter where in the world you are.

 :idea:you are right!!!!
it is 244; is the same capacitor???

thank you!
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #18 on: 25-February-08, 15:36:54 »

Why do you think the front panel problem has to do with the missing component?
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #19 on: 25-February-08, 16:23:48 »

 I don't know what the C244 is for but that IC chip there is the Realtek Ethernet controller.
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #20 on: 25-February-08, 18:36:36 »

You may have to change jumpers to get front panel audio out. By default there are two jumpers set to send the audio out the rear I/O block. That would be interesting if the missing cap only affects a LAN port - could be worse.
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #21 on: 26-February-08, 14:13:23 »

no, no, I am talking about the rear GREEN audio connector, which is the front line (R+L) of the 5.1 channel output.
it does not works....


but Bas?
 :cry:
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #22 on: 26-February-08, 14:14:30 »

That would be interesting if the missing cap only affects a LAN port - could be worse.

it works..... :undecided:
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #23 on: 26-February-08, 14:50:36 »

 Have you got the jumpers as shown below on AUD1/JAUD1 whichever it's called on your board?

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #24 on: 26-February-08, 15:24:46 »

Have you got the jumpers as shown below on AUD1/JAUD1 whichever it's called on your board?



sorry!!!!
sorry!!!!
i am an idiot! :bonk:
you were right!!! :idea:
the vendor has stolen the two jumpers!
fortunally i have some!
well, the audio now is ok!

so, what does the capacitor???
now the problem are: the missing capacitor and the first dimm slot....
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #25 on: 26-February-08, 15:42:21 »

 Another question for you is how many memory sticks will you be using? If you only use 1 or 2 and every thing else in the PC works OK using slots 3 & 4 then don't worry about it any more. It's best to use only 2 memory sticks rather than 4 anyway.
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #26 on: 26-February-08, 15:49:15 »

Another question for you is how many memory sticks will you be using? If you only use 1 or 2 and every thing else in the PC works OK using slots 3 & 4 then don't worry about it any more. It's best to use only 2 memory sticks rather than 4 anyway.

yes, i think i will use only two of them.....
i am looking for 2x1gb ddr400 of good chip memory but......it is hard!
but the vendor...... :angryfire:
he is asking me the feedback..... :biggthumbsdown: :biggthumbsdown:


now, please saint Bas, tell me if the 244 capacitor is 104pF too..... :hypocrite:
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #27 on: 27-February-08, 14:07:01 »

Have you shown a picture of the missing capacitor to the seller? Honestly he probably didn't notice it so give him time to work with you. Hopefully he will refund a little back.

Glad to hear the sound issue was the jumpers. It always is!  ;D
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #28 on: 27-February-08, 15:04:48 »

hi, i have another opinion.
please there is someone who has this motherboard????

i downloaded a picture of the motherboard from msi and looking it i thnk the capacitor n°244 does not exist!!!

take a look:



look near the realteck chipset; i see two sposts soldered, isn't it???


if it is too small, please download this file: http://download1.msi.com.tw/files/downloads/mnu_exe/Q7025v1.0.zip ; look the file named "K8N Neo2 Platinum_A2.jpg"

thank you!
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #29 on: 28-February-08, 03:39:48 »

Which version is your board?  You may be right that C244 is missing on the board pictured which is VER: 0C - mine is VER: 1 and I just looked and it definitely has a C244 capacitor, which is brownish in color, like other SMT caps.
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #30 on: 28-February-08, 08:31:02 »

My Neo2 Platinum ver 1 also has C244.

But out of curiousity I looked at my K8N Neo2-F and it does not have C244!

The K8N Neo2-F is identical to the K8N Neo2 Platinum except it doesn't have firewire or the Realtek LAN port. It uses the exact same PCB for the motherboard but the Realtek chip RTL8110 is missing along with the firewire chip.

So I can say for sure that C244 is part of the Realtek LAN circuitry as HenryW suspected. If your second LAN works 100% reliably then maybe you're good. If there are problems, at least you have the NV LAN port. I doubt that c244 has anything to do with firewire since that chip is way over by the Core Cell processor.
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #31 on: 28-February-08, 08:49:32 »

I will ask again to be sure.
Yes I got the data from MSI.
MSI Europe FAE to be exact :lol_anim:
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #32 on: 28-February-08, 08:52:47 »

Ok, I made a typo, it's indeed 104pf for c244
And yes, it's LAN related.
MSI told me if that cap is missing your Realtek onboard LAN will not work.

Sorry for the confusion.
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #33 on: 28-February-08, 11:28:21 »

Well that pretty much settles it, straight from the horse's mouth!  ;-))
J/K  :D

Anyway gabmamb, are you sure both LAN ports work properly?
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #34 on: 28-February-08, 11:53:25 »

doh!
the lan works and i have the firewire onboard too!

my board is ver:1

thank you all very much!
i will look for it!
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #35 on: 28-February-08, 13:27:16 »

 I downloaded that file and zoomed in on that part of the board w/Photoshop and it looks like the C244 cap is not there even though the Realtek chip is. :think:
 One could also look at the back of the board and see exactly where the circuit lines from the solder points of the cap lead to.
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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #36 on: 28-February-08, 14:23:38 »

Zooming gabmamb's picture to 400% it sure looks like the cap has been stripped off. It's right where the AGP card's expansion bracket goes so I suspect a previous owner was a 400 pound gorilla who got too rough installing the card.

Amazing that you discovered it in the first place gabmamb, good eye man!

Even if the Realtek LAN works I wonder if a demanding performance test might turn up issues.

Might be wise to go with the NV LAN for Gigabit Ethernet, maybe for something very slow like DSL the Realtek would do ok..
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LairdDrambeg

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #37 on: 28-February-08, 16:20:15 »

The most worrying thing about the cap being missing is that the circuitry could violate Ethernet rules for connection in one way or another - wrong voltages, impedance, current on the wire etc. and it could conceivably damage other connected ethernet devices.  I wouldn't use it without the capacitor.

Oh and as for tracing the circuit, with SMT and a 4-layer board, there's no telling what the cap is connected to.
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gabmambTopic starter

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #38 on: 28-February-08, 16:47:35 »

yes i don't really need two ethernet but i will replace the capacitor, if possible....
the previus owner is a beast!
he wrote me an email and said i am an incompetent and that is a little mistake if the first dimm slot does not work and the two jumpers of the front audio panel are missing.....

ebay..... :-P)
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gabmambTopic starter

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #39 on: 28-February-08, 16:49:18 »


Oh and as for tracing the circuit, with SMT and a 4-layer board, there's no telling what the cap is connected to.


sorry i don't understand..... ??? :bonk:
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Fredrik

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #40 on: 28-February-08, 17:31:39 »

You can see with your eyes some of the wires on the motherboard, looking like Los Angeles high-ways between the things on the motherboard.
You can see some, but not all wires, because a motherboard has more than one level. Each level has it's wires/highways.

So what HenryW means is, the component is maybe not connected to the first level of wires, but a lower level.
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Quentin2

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #41 on: 28-February-08, 17:44:41 »

Multilayer circuit boards have many layers of electrical connections. If the capacitor must be soldered to each layer it'll be very difficult to install it properly. If it just needs good contact with the top layer then it's more feasible. Also surface mount soldering is way beyond the skill of the average person. I wouldn't bother trying to replace it, odds are you'll do more harm than good.

A shame so many things went wrong but the board does seem to work so all isn't bad. Of course eBay items are a pig in a poke but usually turn out all right if the seller has good feedback and you have good comunication with him. Out of about 100 eBay purchases over the years I've been satisfied with most of them. Hopefully you'll have better luck next time!
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MSI K8N Neo2, Opteron 180, 2GB G.SKILL PC3200, ATI AIW 9600XT, Cooler Master Centurion 5 mid tower/Cooler Master RP-600-PCAR
GA-K8NS-939, Opteron 175, 1GB PNY Verto PC3500 , ATI AIW 9600XT, Antec Super LANBOY mid tower/Cooler Master RS-450-ACLY
A7N8X-E Deluxe, XP-M 2600+ @218x11, 1GB KVR PC3200, ATI 9550, Lian Li Mid tower/Cooler Master RS-450-ACLY
AN7, XP-M 2800+ @218x11, 1GB HyperX PC3200, ATI AIW 9600XT, Antec Super LANBOY mid tower/Antec TPII Blue 480


http://classicplatforms.com/ Keeping "Old Tech" new.
(formerly was known as SocketAPlus.com)

LairdDrambeg

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Re: Problem with K8N Neo2 Platinum
« Reply #42 on: 28-February-08, 23:37:29 »

I've had good luck reattaching SMT capacitors & resistors - as long as the copper contact pad is not damaged it's not too difficult: just re-tin the pad and the device contact points... carefully of course to avoid to much heat getting into the mbrd.  The tricky bit is holding the device just right so that as you heat the ends it doesn't fly off or go askew.  Like I said earlier, it helps to have a third hand.  Now whether the reattached devices still work as intended, it's always hard to tell.
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