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Saint

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o/c question
« on: 27-March-03, 22:57:25 »

I have a Athlon XP 2000+, MSI K7N2-L, 1x 256Mb crucial Ram, Geforce 4 MX 440, 20 GB Samsung HDD, AOpen CDRW.

My question when I tried to up my CPU multiplier from 266x 12.5 to 266x 13 machine would not post. Am I looking in the right place to O/C or should I start some where else?

Thanks
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loopyloops

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« Reply #1 on: 28-March-03, 00:57:00 »
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    Originally posted by Saint
    I have a Athlon XP 2000+, MSI K7N2-L, 1x 256Mb crucial Ram, Geforce 4 MX 440, 20 GB Samsung HDD, AOpen CDRW.

    My question when I tried to up my CPU multiplier from 266x 12.5 to 266x 13 machine would not post. Am I looking in the right place to O/C or should I start some where else?

    Thanks


    What kind of chip do you have?  Palomino?

    Why don't you try uping your fsb, first.
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    Robbeh

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    « Reply #2 on: 28-March-03, 01:01:23 »

    To alter the multiplier youve gotta unlock the chip first.  Do a search on google for the "wire trick". However loopyloops is right upping the fsb to its limit will give better results and needs no modifications.
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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #3 on: 28-March-03, 23:42:44 »
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    Originally posted by Robbeh
    To alter the multiplier youve gotta unlock the chip first.  Do a search on google for the "wire trick". However loopyloops is right upping the fsb to its limit will give better results and needs no modifications.


    Yes, and overclock your ram as well - if it likes such treatment.
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    Wonkanoby

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    « Reply #4 on: 28-March-03, 23:44:15 »
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  • wire tricks for thrbrd only ,paint the bridges on older pally
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    brummieman

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    « Reply #5 on: 30-March-03, 06:20:44 »

    I thought the wire trick would work for all XP's ....won't it ?  ?(
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    AofI

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    « Reply #6 on: 30-March-03, 06:25:20 »

    nope t-bred only
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    brummieman

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    « Reply #7 on: 30-March-03, 22:42:51 »

    OH..was a waste of time me saving that pic of the trick then LOL

    This 'painting the bridges' , I assume its conductive material, what do you paint and between where ?  :))


    Also another question :

    I have overclocked my XP 2000+ using the FSB, I got it up to 144mhz, but then noticed random reboots etc, i have slowly stepped down until now it is stable at 138MhZ.

    Question...what is the likely cause of the reboots higher up..I gather many get upto 144 stable.  Is it the memory, and if so what are the best stable settings for the memory (2700 CLR2.5...currently I have it set to 'set by SLD' whatever that means)  :]

    thanks
    Brummieman
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    Wonkanoby

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    « Reply #8 on: 30-March-03, 22:47:03 »
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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #9 on: 31-March-03, 00:17:51 »
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    Originally posted by brummieman
    OH..was a waste of time me saving that pic of the trick then LOL

    This 'painting the bridges' , I assume its conductive material, what do you paint and between where ?  :))


    Also another question :

    I have overclocked my XP 2000+ using the FSB, I got it up to 144mhz, but then noticed random reboots etc, i have slowly stepped down until now it is stable at 138MhZ.

    Question...what is the likely cause of the reboots higher up..I gather many get upto 144 stable.  Is it the memory, and if so what are the best stable settings for the memory (2700 CLR2.5...currently I have it set to 'set by SLD' whatever that means)  :]

    thanks
    Brummieman


    I had a 2000+ Palamino and could only get to 137 stable.   It was frustrating, so I opted to plunk down $60 and get an 1800+ t-bred.  You can bump you fsb up to 166 and higher with no problem at all.  Getting one of these will save you the hassle of filling in those hole - unless that's fun for you (which it could be).
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    brummieman

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    « Reply #10 on: 31-March-03, 01:09:33 »

    Thanks for the help..the video of linking the L1 bridges was instructive..but not sure I fancy that trick..looks a bit messy LOL, especially as the bios only allows a multiplier of 13 max so dosen't seem a great leap from 12.5.

    I will look for a t-bird at some point I think....but still not sure about the memory settings ?

    When I raise the FSB, am I forcing the memory to speed up aswell, and should anything above 138 MHz be a problem for 2700 CLR 2.5 memory ?

    Thanks
    Brummieman
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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #11 on: 31-March-03, 01:37:34 »
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    Originally posted by brummieman
    Thanks for the help..the video of linking the L1 bridges was instructive..but not sure I fancy that trick..looks a bit messy LOL, especially as the bios only allows a multiplier of 13 max so dosen't seem a great leap from 12.5.

    I will look for a t-bird at some point I think....but still not sure about the memory settings ?

    When I raise the FSB, am I forcing the memory to speed up aswell, and should anything above 138 MHz be a problem for 2700 CLR 2.5 memory ?

    Thanks
    Brummieman


    First off, with PC2700, you can go up to 333 (166).  Also, it's the lower multis that'll be benificial - 13 is high enough on the high end.
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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #12 on: 31-March-03, 01:46:48 »
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    Originally posted by brummieman
    Thanks for the help..the video of linking the L1 bridges was instructive..but not sure I fancy that trick..looks a bit messy LOL, especially as the bios only allows a multiplier of 13 max so dosen't seem a great leap from 12.5.

    I will look for a t-bird at some point I think....but still not sure about the memory settings ?

    When I raise the FSB, am I forcing the memory to speed up aswell, and should anything above 138 MHz be a problem for 2700 CLR 2.5 memory ?

    Thanks
    Brummieman


    P.S. Your fsb/ram ratio should be set to 1:1.  If it's at the default 2:3, you'll have problems increasing your fsb as your ram is already at 333 when your fsb is at 133.
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    brummieman

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    « Reply #13 on: 31-March-03, 02:25:23 »

    Thanks ..that is very helpful and probably explains why its falling over..I will try reducing my memory speed...tho I s'ppose there is a trade off as to whether 144 MHz FSB with the mem running at 144MHz is gonna b faster than a FSB of 138MHz with the RAM running at 333 MHz.
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    brummieman

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    « Reply #14 on: 31-March-03, 04:34:18 »

    Well ..now running at 142 MHz FSB (1.78 MHz Chip) and so far seems to be stable....seems the 1:1 memory timings did help. :D

    Thanks
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    Robbeh

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    « Reply #15 on: 31-March-03, 04:56:41 »

    Running the ram at 333 not sync is slower than 266 sync.  For the best performance youll need to lower the multiplier which will let you raise your fsb to 166 and beyond.
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    brummieman

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    « Reply #16 on: 31-March-03, 05:02:05 »

    How do I know what is in sync or not.... it is not clear to me whether it is the setting in BIOS that should be the same...or is it double the figure in BIOS ?

    This DDR / doubling FSB makes it more confusing LOL (e.g. with my mem at 1:1 and a FSB of 142, is my memory running at 142 MHz or 248 MHz ?)
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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #17 on: 31-March-03, 06:23:47 »
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    Originally posted by brummieman
    Well ..now running at 142 MHz FSB (1.78 MHz Chip) and so far seems to be stable....seems the 1:1 memory timings did help. :D

    Thanks


    Well, remember, 142 is 284 - not far from 333.  You might try uping that fsb even more.  You might have to up your vcore if you experience instability.  If'n you did get it to 166, well then you'd be at 333.  Also, to see if you're benifiting from the increased cpu power, try running 3dmark2001 se at your default settings and then with your increasd fsb - the higher one wins!!

    And remember, up that fsb only a couple at a time.  Also, I'm in no way responsible for you frying your computer :-)!!!!
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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #18 on: 31-March-03, 11:58:55 »
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    Originally posted by Robbeh
    Running the ram at 333 not sync is slower than 266 sync.  For the best performance youll need to lower the multiplier which will let you raise your fsb to 166 and beyond.


    Are you sure?  Ya mean you'd be faster leaving your fsb at 133 and having your ram at 266 than 133/333?  The 1:1 is what you need to overclock, but just 'cause you're not in sync you're slower?  I don't think so.

    Someone else care to chime in?
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    lowrider87

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    « Reply #19 on: 31-March-03, 13:58:16 »
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  • loopyloops,

    Quite a few of the reveiws that came out when the nF2 first came out, said Sync was the fastest. Myself I have crappy PC2100 in my comp and I am taking a hit on performance by running my ram at 75%. I am doing this only to get to 200 fsb with out crashes. To get the best performance it should be run at 1:1 when overclocking.
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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #20 on: 31-March-03, 23:10:52 »
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    Originally posted by lowrider87
    loopyloops,

    Quite a few of the reveiws that came out when the nF2 first came out, said Sync was the fastest. Myself I have crappy PC2100 in my comp and I am taking a hit on performance by running my ram at 75%. I am doing this only to get to 200 fsb with out crashes. To get the best performance it should be run at 1:1 when overclocking.


    To get the best performance it should be run at 1:1 when overclocking.


    That's the ticket!  But I'm correct when I say that at default leverls, ram going faster - 2:3 - would give better performance than, say 1:1.  By the way, with pc2100, wouldn't 1:1 be the logical default?

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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #21 on: 31-March-03, 23:11:31 »
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    Originally posted by lowrider87
    loopyloops,

    Quite a few of the reveiws that came out when the nF2 first came out, said Sync was the fastest. Myself I have crappy PC2100 in my comp and I am taking a hit on performance by running my ram at 75%. I am doing this only to get to 200 fsb with out crashes. To get the best performance it should be run at 1:1 when overclocking.


    To get the best performance it should be run at 1:1 when overclocking.


    That's the ticket!  But I'm correct when I say that at default levels, ram going faster - 2:3 - would give better performance than, say 1:1.  By the way, with pc2100, wouldn't 1:1 be the logical default?

    And btw, 60% of what I know I've learned from you!  Thanks!

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    backwoodz

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    « Reply #22 on: 31-March-03, 23:43:53 »

    Quote
    To get the best performance it should be run at 1:1 when overclocking
    That's the ticket!

    With present bios and setup all NF2 boards run at best performance when run 1.1 FSB/DRAM. It does not have nothing to do with overclocking.
    Quote
    But I'm correct when I say that at default levels, ram going faster - 2:3 - would give better performance than, say 1:1.

    This is going to have alot to do with cpu/ram configurations.
    For example someone running a 200fsb duron and 3200 memory....then yes I would say 2.3 would be better for overall performance......But an XP or Barton should be set 1.1 with the same ram.
    Hopefully future bios updates will help the issue.
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    « Reply #23 on: 01-April-03, 00:19:48 »
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    Originally posted by backwoodz
    Quote
    To get the best performance it should be run at 1:1 when overclocking
    That's the ticket!

    With present bios and setup all NF2 boards run at best performance when run 1.1 FSB/DRAM. It does not have nothing to do with overclocking.
    Quote
    But I'm correct when I say that at default levels, ram going faster - 2:3 - would give better performance than, say 1:1.

    This is going to have alot to do with cpu/ram configurations.
    For example someone running a 200fsb duron and 3200 memory....then yes I would say 2.3 would be better for overall performance......But an XP or Barton should be set 1.1 with the same ram.
    Hopefully future bios updates will help the issue.


    So, for clarification, if I leave everything at the defaults and I run 3dmark2001 se, I'll get a lower score then if I  change my ratio to 1:1 - even though my pc3200 will be running at 266?
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    Robbeh

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    « Reply #24 on: 01-April-03, 00:20:08 »

    loopyloops, running your ram at faster speeds than the fsb adds latency, slowing down memory performance ( I read somewhere it results in data from the ram being cached while the cpu catches up).  This is why upping the fsb to run at the ram's rated speed gives such a big performance boost
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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #25 on: 01-April-03, 01:31:40 »
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    Originally posted by Robbeh
    loopyloops, running your ram at faster speeds than the fsb adds latency, slowing down memory performance ( I read somewhere it results in data from the ram being cached while the cpu catches up).  This is why upping the fsb to run at the ram's rated speed gives such a big performance boost


    I see.  Good to know.  

    Speking of RAM, I'm gettin another stick of Corsair pc3200 512 mbs today!!  
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    lowrider87

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    « Reply #26 on: 01-April-03, 01:40:57 »
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  • loopyloops,

    In my bios I have the ability to set my ram usage. I can run in sync or set it manually to what I want. I was having problems at the 200 fsb with crashing or not posting. I set my ram at 75% which set me at 150 mhz instead of 200 mhz in sync. This helped me out considerable on the crashes. My PC 2100 did not like the higher settings. I could only get as high as 170X12 running 1:1 with the ram.
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    loopyloops

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    « Reply #27 on: 01-April-03, 02:12:19 »
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    Originally posted by lowrider87
    loopyloops,

    In my bios I have the ability to set my ram usage. I can run in sync or set it manually to what I want. I was having problems at the 200 fsb with crashing or not posting. I set my ram at 75% which set me at 150 mhz instead of 200 mhz in sync. This helped me out considerable on the crashes. My PC 2100 did not like the higher settings. I could only get as high as 170X12 running 1:1 with the ram.


    Oh yeah.  I run it 1:1 :-)
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