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Author Topic: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work  (Read 4314 times)

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t.eccardTopic starter

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Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« on: 17-January-16, 02:23:22 »

Hi guys,

I have recently bought:

- i7 6700
- HyperX DDR4 4x 4GB 2133MHz Cl13 XMP Predator (HX421C13PBK4/16)
- MSI Z170A MATE

It looks like I'm having some sort of compatibility issues or configurations problems with mobo and ram.
When I put two stick into slots 2-4 everything works fine, passes all tests (memtest, occt, games) and works flawlessly. Slots 1-3 works fine too, for every single ram stick from the set.
Problems occurs when I try to add more than 2 sticks. Memtest fails and shows lots of errors.

I've read a lot bad things of this mobo problems on the net and I'm confused. It should work since these modules are listed on compatibility tables.
I have also checked the cpu socket for the bad pins with magnifying glass and tested the CPU with intel cpu test - both ok! Temperatures and voltages are also fine.

I don't wanna send this mobo back because it works stable on 2 sticks and I don't wanna stress other components for disassembling. I'm planning to change it in the next few months but I'm writing here because maybe I missed something and there is solution that can help me.

My current setup is:
- i7 6700 (OCCT test max 67C after 15 minutes)
- HyperX DDR4 4x 4GB 2133MHz Cl13 XMP Predator [HX421C13PBK4/16] (1.2V - default bios settings, no OC)
- MSI Z170A MATE (bios updated A.6 2015-12-21)
- Fractal Design INTEGRA (500W, 80+)
- 1 ssd, 2 hdds
- Esi Julia
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badboy2k

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #1 on: 17-January-16, 02:41:19 »

test the other 2 sticks in the same slots as the 2 you have already tested as you may have a bad stick among the other 2?
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OS: Windows7 professional SP1 64bit (OEM)
Motherboard: MSI 790FX-GD70 (bios 1.17) AM3
Processor:AMD phenom IIx4 955 black edition 3.2GHz processor(Clock speed of 4GHz)
Cooler: corsair H100 cooler
Ram: 16GB Corsair Dominator DDR3 1600MHz ram (2 dual channel kits model: CMP8GX3M2A1600C9) (underclocked at 1333MHz)
GPU: 1: MSI R7870 -2GD5T/OC @ 1155mhz , 2: MSI R7850-Twin Frozer 2GD5/OC @ 925mhz
PSU: Thermaltake tougthpower 1500W (+12v1 20A, +12v2 20A, +12v3 40A, +12v4 40A) (+12v1=20+4 connector, +12v2=CPU power, +12v3=PCI_E connections, +12v4 = molex+sata+PCI_E connectors  )
Extras: 1 x 4 port raid card (model SIL3114) ASUS Xonar Essence STX sound card PCI-E X1.

t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #2 on: 17-January-16, 02:51:58 »

I have tested all sticks in 2 slot configuration (8gb) and all of them works this way. Problems occurs only when I try to mount more than 2 sticks.
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badboy2k

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #3 on: 17-January-16, 03:04:12 »

what is your actual DRAM Voltage set at?
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OS: Windows7 professional SP1 64bit (OEM)
Motherboard: MSI 790FX-GD70 (bios 1.17) AM3
Processor:AMD phenom IIx4 955 black edition 3.2GHz processor(Clock speed of 4GHz)
Cooler: corsair H100 cooler
Ram: 16GB Corsair Dominator DDR3 1600MHz ram (2 dual channel kits model: CMP8GX3M2A1600C9) (underclocked at 1333MHz)
GPU: 1: MSI R7870 -2GD5T/OC @ 1155mhz , 2: MSI R7850-Twin Frozer 2GD5/OC @ 925mhz
PSU: Thermaltake tougthpower 1500W (+12v1 20A, +12v2 20A, +12v3 40A, +12v4 40A) (+12v1=20+4 connector, +12v2=CPU power, +12v3=PCI_E connections, +12v4 = molex+sata+PCI_E connectors  )
Extras: 1 x 4 port raid card (model SIL3114) ASUS Xonar Essence STX sound card PCI-E X1.

t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #4 on: 17-January-16, 03:17:22 »

1.2V, all default settings
I was trying 1.1V - 1.3V without success.



---
I think I can now add external links.
This is how errors looks like when 4 modules installed:




 (my debug place)


edit:
I just noticed that memtest shows them as KHX2133C13D4 not HX421C13PBK4 like it should ?
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badboy2k

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #5 on: 17-January-16, 05:29:33 »

are you running the 4 sticks in CR 1or2? (for 4 sticks you should run them in CR2 mode on the command rate or in CR1 mode they will error!)
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OS: Windows7 professional SP1 64bit (OEM)
Motherboard: MSI 790FX-GD70 (bios 1.17) AM3
Processor:AMD phenom IIx4 955 black edition 3.2GHz processor(Clock speed of 4GHz)
Cooler: corsair H100 cooler
Ram: 16GB Corsair Dominator DDR3 1600MHz ram (2 dual channel kits model: CMP8GX3M2A1600C9) (underclocked at 1333MHz)
GPU: 1: MSI R7870 -2GD5T/OC @ 1155mhz , 2: MSI R7850-Twin Frozer 2GD5/OC @ 925mhz
PSU: Thermaltake tougthpower 1500W (+12v1 20A, +12v2 20A, +12v3 40A, +12v4 40A) (+12v1=20+4 connector, +12v2=CPU power, +12v3=PCI_E connections, +12v4 = molex+sata+PCI_E connectors  )
Extras: 1 x 4 port raid card (model SIL3114) ASUS Xonar Essence STX sound card PCI-E X1.

t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #6 on: 17-January-16, 05:33:50 »

Thanks for this tip, i'll test it in next 2-3 hours.
Where should I look for this option ?
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badboy2k

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #7 on: 17-January-16, 05:47:23 »

go into:

Overclocking settings OC
Advanced DRAM configuration
Command Rate (change from Auto to 2)

also if your using 4 sticks also check what timings its using: if its 13-13-13 (tCL 13 - tRCD 13 - tRP 13) change them to the JDEC standard ones of 15-15-15.
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OS: Windows7 professional SP1 64bit (OEM)
Motherboard: MSI 790FX-GD70 (bios 1.17) AM3
Processor:AMD phenom IIx4 955 black edition 3.2GHz processor(Clock speed of 4GHz)
Cooler: corsair H100 cooler
Ram: 16GB Corsair Dominator DDR3 1600MHz ram (2 dual channel kits model: CMP8GX3M2A1600C9) (underclocked at 1333MHz)
GPU: 1: MSI R7870 -2GD5T/OC @ 1155mhz , 2: MSI R7850-Twin Frozer 2GD5/OC @ 925mhz
PSU: Thermaltake tougthpower 1500W (+12v1 20A, +12v2 20A, +12v3 40A, +12v4 40A) (+12v1=20+4 connector, +12v2=CPU power, +12v3=PCI_E connections, +12v4 = molex+sata+PCI_E connectors  )
Extras: 1 x 4 port raid card (model SIL3114) ASUS Xonar Essence STX sound card PCI-E X1.

t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #8 on: 17-January-16, 08:48:07 »

Thanks for your help badboy2k. Sadly this didn't work.

Before changing anything I wanted to compare current settings with suggested ones. I was surprised when I noticed that my current settings are exactly the same as suggested. Command Rate 2 (auto) and timings 15. I decided to give a try anyway:

4x4gb 1-2-3-4

I've installed additional modules into 1-3 slots and forced settings to cr 2 and cl 15.
Memtest result was the same - errors from the very beginning of the test. I have tried different settings without success.

2x4gb 2-4
Then I have restored (manually) settings I've changed before and removed modules from slots 1-3. Memtest passed without a single error, Intel test aswell, everything works stable.

Memtest



CPU test


Current Memory Settings:



This is first time I'm having an issue like this. I'm pretty sure it's mobo related since there is absolutely no issues when using 2 ram modules (no matter which ones I choose from set). I have currently no backup budget for this so I can test only very possible solutions to avoid accidentiall damages. It looks like I'm gonna be forced to wait till next bios update or to change this mobo in the nearest future...
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JLio01

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #9 on: 18-January-16, 01:00:18 »

Where do you check the compatibility list?? I don't see this kit on the list?
http://www.msi.com/product/motherboard/support/Z170A-PC-MATE.html#support-mem
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t.eccardTopic starter

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t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #11 on: 18-January-16, 05:02:11 »

I had some spare time today so I wrote to MSI support and also made some bios settings screenshots:

(stable configuration, 2x4gb modules on slots 2-4, default bios settings)
msiz170mate_biossettings.zip
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t.eccardTopic starter

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badboy2k

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #13 on: 18-January-16, 19:45:56 »

http://www.tomshardware.com/news/skylake-prime-number-bug,30979.html might be related to this ?

no its not related to it! that is a very specific bug with the CPU and calculating Extremely big Prime Numbers and has nothing to do with your problem at all...
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OS: Windows7 professional SP1 64bit (OEM)
Motherboard: MSI 790FX-GD70 (bios 1.17) AM3
Processor:AMD phenom IIx4 955 black edition 3.2GHz processor(Clock speed of 4GHz)
Cooler: corsair H100 cooler
Ram: 16GB Corsair Dominator DDR3 1600MHz ram (2 dual channel kits model: CMP8GX3M2A1600C9) (underclocked at 1333MHz)
GPU: 1: MSI R7870 -2GD5T/OC @ 1155mhz , 2: MSI R7850-Twin Frozer 2GD5/OC @ 925mhz
PSU: Thermaltake tougthpower 1500W (+12v1 20A, +12v2 20A, +12v3 40A, +12v4 40A) (+12v1=20+4 connector, +12v2=CPU power, +12v3=PCI_E connections, +12v4 = molex+sata+PCI_E connectors  )
Extras: 1 x 4 port raid card (model SIL3114) ASUS Xonar Essence STX sound card PCI-E X1.

t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #14 on: 19-January-16, 01:43:21 »

Yeah...
Spent few days looking for solution and it looks like there is no way to fix it atm. I think I need to wait till next BIOS update.
https://forum-en.msi.com/index.php?topic=260342.0

edit: tried bios A50 with no success.
I've also took some bios screens with 4x4gb configuration (non-stable)
msiz170mate_bios_16.zip
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t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #15 on: 25-January-16, 02:47:06 »

After week of consulting, doing tests and research with Intel and Kingston (still waiting for answer from MSI) - it looks like it's definitely mobo related. I'm very impressed with both Intel and Kingston tech support level.

I'm going to replace this motherboard in the nearest future.
Please do not close this topic - I want to let you know of the results after replacing mobo - maybe someone will find it useful.
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Svet

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #16 on: 26-January-16, 09:52:29 »

MSI are working to resolve this issue asap
Will update this topic once solution is available
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t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #17 on: 26-January-16, 10:17:56 »

Oh this is cool ! Thanks for the info, I'll wait then.
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Svet

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #18 on: 29-January-16, 10:41:55 »

Update:

Got info that problem is the Intel RC code has a general compatiblity issue with this particular ram kit.
This means that any boards who use the same memory are affected, not just the msi one, but any with regardless of vendor.
But MSI are working to provide a solution to this, so please wait patiently for update and solution.
I will update this topic once there is a solution available.
Until wait you can try to set timings to 15-15-15 and up the voltage abit to 1.35V
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t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #19 on: 30-January-16, 00:30:20 »

Thanks for sharing this info with us. I also appreciate that MSI is working to resolve this problem.

However I'm also a little bit confused and angry - why non-compatible memory kit is listed on the QVL ?
I thought that these modules were tested on this particular mobo and this was one of the main reasons I've bought it.
I knew from the very beginning this is not an usual issue and it took me so much time to investigate it...

Anyway I'm happy I didn't spent more money and time to get other mobos and cpus trying to resolve this. Thats why, in my opinion, memory compatibility tables should be updated ASAP to protect new customers from getting into this problem.
I'm going to share this with Intel and Kingston too because it's their fault as well.

Waiting for the update and thanks - I will finally sleep at night.
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t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #20 on: 01-February-16, 02:51:35 »

(...)
Until wait you can try to set timings to 15-15-15 and up the voltage abit to 1.35V

I was trying this on the very beginning without success.
Waiting for the update.
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t.eccardTopic starter

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Re: Z170A PC MATE - Kingston Predator 4/16 don't work
« Reply #21 on: 18-February-16, 11:18:09 »

Ok so... I have bought hx421c13sbk2/16 modules and it's almost 7 days from installing them.
No problems at all, including when using on high load and stress tests. Memtest passed all tests I know without any problems many times.

I had 1 freeze and it was the only freeze on this PC ever. In DayZ game, but I'm pretty sure it was game or gfx driver related because screen went off and I heard game sounds for few more seconds before freeze. I tried to reproduce it in all ways I know but I couldn't so it has to be random.

Although it works I'm very disappointed and angry of this rig. I'm probably stay away from the hardware I used next time.

edit: oh I almost forgot ! - big thanks to those who tried to help - Thank You !
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